<html> <body> Hi Ron,                   I like it, a very clean knot.    Smiling:  Ted Sambell has often said.  " Very little is new in the piano business, but lots of old ideas re visited."  I really think he is right.  Just a matter of getting the right mix and execution of old ideas. Regards Roger At 11:01 PM 4/9/2005, you wrote: <blockquote type=cite class=cite cite="">Hi all, This is the second time this topic has come up on the list. Sorry about my delayed contribution to the topic, but I have only today converted the images below to low-res for publication on the list. The synchronous timing of ideas can be simply amazing. When Roger J first sent me an email with an image showing the double looped eyes he was using, I had been almost simultaneously working through a similar idea for my own piano. I have always liked the idea of the German looped eye for back scale flexibility but the tendency of these terminations to pull tight on the hitch pin was, for me, a negative against their use. After some consideration it occurred to me that if the coil was centralised to the wire, by bending a 90 degree bend in the wire before making the coil, it should prevent the coil tightening on the hitch pin. I made a jig for building a prototype, and found that my speculation proved correct. And just when I thought I'd re-invented the wheel, along came an image from Jolly through the 'ether'. Furthermore, a couple of months later when servicing an Australian made Beale concert grand in Dubbo, I discovered that the Beale also was strung using the same idea. And Michael informs us that Broadwood was using it much earlier again. Anyhow, for those of you who may be interested, I scanned a close-up of our centralised loop, and the jig which I use for their manufacture. A loop is shown below. <div align="center"> <img src="cid:6.2.0.14.0.20050411223117.036633c8@mail.sasktel.net.2" width=308 height=325 alt="[]"> </div> (if your browser doesn't display the above image, it can be found online at; http://members.optusnet.com.au/ronovers/dblloopeye.jpg ) This loop can be taken off the piano and replaced again without any problem, since the loop won't tighten on the hitch pin (so bass string twisting, at a later date, will not be a pain in the neck). The first bend in the wire, as the wire turns from the back scale length into the first coil, is what prevents it from tightening on the hitch. We cut the tail with the pliers held so that the sharp end of the tail doesn't contact the plate, to avoid un-necessary scratching of the finish. The jig which we use to make the above eye is shown below. <div align="center"> <img src="cid:6.2.0.14.0.20050411223117.036633c8@mail.sasktel.net.3" width=624 height=350 alt="[]"> </div> (if your browser doesn't show the above image, it can be found online at; http://members.optusnet.com.au/ronovers/eyejig.jpg ) The jig consists of a small clamp which holds the wire adjacent to the coil forming pin. The short wire-bend (visible above the knurled clamp-tightening hand screw) allows the coil to be formed using a small pair of parallel jaw pliers. The knurled hand screw was made with a long shank, so that its overall length allows us to set the appropriate wire distance between the two bends, before making the coil. Ron O. <pre>-- </pre> OVERS PIANOS - SYDNEY    Grand Piano Manufacturers _______________________ Web <a href="http://overspianos.com.au/" eudora="autourl"> http://overspianos.com.au</a> <a href="mailto:ron@overspianos.com.au" eudora="autourl"> mailto:ron@overspianos.com.au</a> _______________________ </blockquote></body> </html>