<HTML>. <BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE style="BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px">Subj:Re: Laminated Soundboard Ribs Date:2/11/2002 6:59:46 PM Pacific Standard Time From:<A HREF="mailto:mfarrel2@tampabay.rr.com">mfarrel2@tampabay.rr.com</A> Reply-to:<A HREF="mailto:pianotech@ptg.org">pianotech@ptg.org</A> To:<A HREF="mailto:pianotech@ptg.org">pianotech@ptg.org</A> Sent from the Internet    Terry</BLOCKQUOTE>         Do you have too much time on your hands? Nahhhh.          You seem to be asking the right questions lately so you can't be gettin any sleep.         Laminated any thing is usually stiffer. Sounboard ribs are no different. I have and am currently experimenting with this ./ I have installed laminated ribs on one board. One advantage to this I think is that they can be stiffer without an increase in mass. Another is that it utilizes otherwise unusable lumber. I make these in my neumatic press which eliminates cutting the crown into them as they are preformed to a 60 ft. radius. It's very slick ,kind of messy. So far I'm just using three laminations and have only used them on the longer ribs say 7 of 12 ribs.  I'm not sure if the treble ribs really need it as they are already stiffer than the original ribs by virtue of there machined in crown. And the stiffness is increasing as they get shorter and shorter and are glued to narrower parts of the board which is also increasing stiffness. And if you use spruce over sugar pine yet stiffer ribs result. I personally like tight grain sugar pine in the top.      As you get further into this you'll realize that a key question that you'll need to answer is how stiff is stiff enough when were talking about sound board stiffness and its benifits to tone. I personally don't know.but obviously the trebles of old compression crowned boards were not stiff enough at least not long term.    I find it highly likely that a compression crowned board with little compression to start with  loses most of its stiffness and hence most of its vitality within 10 or 20 years. Shocking ehh?    As to the cutting thru the grain thing. If you just take out an old soundboard and cut it into strips cleanoff the varnish and glue them up you've got yourself a quarter sawn rib. Yeah why not?   Can't help with the Weber serial no. Happy Hunting >>>>Dale Erwin>>>>> <BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE style="BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px"> I guess a lot of my thinking comes from laminating ribs on boat hulls. I do realize that a soundboard is not a hull. And the laminated ribs on the boat replace steam-bent oak ribs. The laminated ones are nice because they tend to hold their shape way better than the steam bent ones. You may well be right that laminated would not be any stiffer than a solid rib. Part of my thinking is also that you need to saw through the grain to make a crowned soundboard rib - but of course, you are only cutting into it 1/8-inch or so. Some boats have sawn ribs and you end up with much of the wood grain not in a preferred orientation. I guess not such a big deal on the piano. I was also thinking of making a good use for the old soundboard. If you had laminated ribs, you could just cut up the old soundboard and at least make nice laminated ribs from it. I'm also just posting because no-one will help me with my German F. Weber serial #19290! Terry Farrell   ----- Original Message ----- From: "Phillip L Ford" <fordpiano@lycos.com> To: <pianotech@ptg.org> Sent: Monday, February 11, 2002 9:52 PM Subject: Re: Laminated Soundboard Ribs > Terry, > What makes you think that the laminated rib would be stiffer than a solid rib of > the same dimensions (assuming the laminations are of the same material as > the solid rib)? > > Phil F > --- > Phillip Ford > Piano Service & Restoration > 1777 Yosemite Ave - 215 > San Francisco, CA  94124 > > > On Mon, 11 Feb 2002 07:47:43  >  Farrell wrote: > >If ribs are supposed to add stiffness to a soundboard, I would think that a laminated rib might offer some advantages. It would be stiffer for the same dimension than a non-laminated rib, and I should think you could control the stiffness to a greater degree. Also, might the rib shape tend to last longer? Has this been explored previously? > > > >Terry Farrell > >  > > > > > > > Go Get It! > Send FREE Valentine eCards with Lycos Greetings > http://greetings.lycos.com </BLOCKQUOTE> </HTML>