<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN"> <HTML><HEAD> <META http-equiv=Content-Type content="text/html; = charset=iso-8859-1"> <META content="MSHTML 6.00.2600.0" name=GENERATOR> <STYLE></STYLE> </HEAD> <BODY bgColor=#ffffff> <DIV><SPAN class=637281122-21092002><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff = size=2>David</FONT></SPAN></DIV> <DIV><SPAN class=637281122-21092002><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff = size=2>The one I had did not really respond to voicing in the shoulders, as being = too mushy there. May be with a few deep stitches from the start it could gain some = more active resilience. </FONT></SPAN></DIV> <DIV><SPAN class=637281122-21092002><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff = size=2>As it was the tension was almost none, but very nice felt = indeed.</FONT></SPAN></DIV> <DIV><SPAN class=637281122-21092002><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff = size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV> <DIV><SPAN class=637281122-21092002><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff = size=2>Renner use this felt since a few years, and I believe actually on all their = hammers. The problem they have is that the molding they buy (I understand that = they don't do that themselves) are more stiffer than before, and they don't like to = make hammers with that sharp wooden molding as in some Steinway, Bechstein, etc.</FONT></SPAN></DIV> <DIV><SPAN class=637281122-21092002><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff = size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV> <DIV><SPAN class=637281122-21092002><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff = size=2>I suspect that the Wurzen Felt, being softer, is more prone to be damaged = if forced on a sharp molding. Beside, of course they would hate to break = the moldings in the gluing process, and that is more the case with thin = moldings of course.</FONT></SPAN></DIV> <DIV><SPAN class=637281122-21092002><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff = size=2>Nowadays, All actual hammers, for Steinways, and other makes, = are generally thicker wood, and this felt that techs are often wondering how = to treat.</FONT></SPAN></DIV> <DIV><SPAN class=637281122-21092002><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff = size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV> <DIV><SPAN class=637281122-21092002><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff = size=2>But of course "nothing never changed " will be told you if you = ask.</FONT></SPAN></DIV> <DIV><SPAN class=637281122-21092002><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff = size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV> <DIV><SPAN class=637281122-21092002><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff = size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV> <DIV><SPAN class=637281122-21092002><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff = size=2>I had to needle a C1 hammer (on a Yamaha G2) , and indeed 30 stitches was the = maximum in the medium (for first voicing), a bit too much near the break. In the = treble I begin to voice at 9:30, but finally was obliged to go back from the = low regions, as the strength was not enough.</FONT></SPAN></DIV> <DIV><SPAN class=637281122-21092002><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff = size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV> <DIV><SPAN class=637281122-21092002><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff = size=2>I will see that again after a bit of playing, I guess the natural sound of this = felt is enough as it is, not really crisp, mellow and round but forcefully enough.</FONT></SPAN></DIV> <DIV><SPAN class=637281122-21092002><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff = size=2>It will be clearer in time, but not at all as the tone of the old Yamaha = hammers, so metallic, I for sure like it better (and C1 C2 hammer assembly for = Yamahas are cheap (around $430).</FONT></SPAN></DIV> <DIV><SPAN class=637281122-21092002><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff = size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV> <DIV><SPAN class=637281122-21092002><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff = size=2>Regards and good Sunday</FONT></SPAN></DIV> <DIV><SPAN class=637281122-21092002><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff = size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV> <DIV><SPAN class=637281122-21092002><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff = size=2>Isaac OLEG</FONT></SPAN></DIV> <BLOCKQUOTE dir=ltr style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px = solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px"> <DIV class=OutlookMessageHeader dir=ltr align=left><FONT = face=Tahoma size=2>-----Message d'origine-----<BR><B>De :</B> pianotech-bounces@ptg.org [mailto:pianotech-bounces@ptg.org]<B>De la = part de</B> David Love<BR><B>Envoyé :</B> samedi 21 septembre 2002 18:08<BR><B>À :</B> Pianotech<BR><B>Objet :</B> Re: hammer = felt<BR><BR></FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT size=2>According to a fairly recent conversation I had = with Lloyd Meyer, Renner blues are Wurzen felt.  The Renner blue is somewhat = softer than its European counterpart.  Where Andre is needing 30 = stitches in the tenor, a Renner blue will need considerably less.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT size=2></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT size=2>David Love</FONT></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV><FONT size=2></FONT> </DIV> <DIV>----- Original Message ----- </DIV> <BLOCKQUOTE style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; = BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px"> <DIV style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: = black"><B>From:</B> <A title=Erwinspiano@aol.com href="mailto:Erwinspiano@aol.com">Erwinspiano@aol.com</A> </DIV> <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A = title=pianotech@ptg.org href="mailto:pianotech@ptg.org">pianotech@ptg.org</A> </DIV> <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> September 21, 2002 8:06 = AM</DIV> <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: hammer = felt</DIV> <DIV><BR></DIV><FONT face=arial,helvetica><FONT lang=0 face="Times New Roman" size=2 FAMILY="SERIF">In a message = dated 9/21/2002 1:32:12 AM Pacific Daylight Time, <A href="mailto:antares@euronet.nl">antares@euronet.nl</A> writes:<BR><BR></FONT><FONT lang=0 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: = #ffffff" face=Arial color=#000000 size=2 FAMILY="SANSSERIF"><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff = 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px" TYPE="CITE">Subj:<B>hammer felt </B><BR>Date:9/21/2002 1:32:12 AM = Pacific Daylight Time<BR>From:<A = href="mailto:antares@euronet.nl">antares@euronet.nl</A><BR>Reply-to:<A = href="mailto:pianotech@ptg.org">pianotech@ptg.org</A><BR>To:<A href="mailto:pianotech@ptg.org">pianotech@ptg.org</A><BR><I>Sent = from the Internet = </I><BR><BR>         Antares</FONT><FONT lang=0 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff" = face=Arial color=#000000 size=2 = FAMILY="SANSSERIF"></BLOCKQUOTE><BR></FONT><FONT lang=0 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff" face=Arial color=#000000 = size=3 FAMILY="SANSSERIF"><BR></FONT><FONT lang=0 = style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff" face="Times New Roman" color=#000000 size=3 = FAMILY="SERIF">         &n= bsp;  I believe the only hammer like this in America cost about 800 = dollars and it is sold by the Steinway factory. I heard a couple of sample hammers = in a piano and I confess I was impressed. But two hammers is not really a = fair assesment for me however  my friend has used a couple of sets = on larger steinways and he loved the sounds. But 800 bucks is to rich for my = blood. What do these hammers cost in Europe? If it's less than half of 800 = I'll try a set.<BR>Regards<BR>    Dale Erwin</FONT><FONT = lang=0 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff" face=Arial color=#000000 = size=2 FAMILY="SANSSERIF"><BR></FONT><FONT lang=0 = style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff" face=Arial color=#000000 size=2 FAMILY="SANSSERIF"><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff = 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px" TYPE="CITE"><BR>And then I say (speaking from a long time = experience) :<BR><BR>Try the Renner hammers with Wurzen felt.<BR>I don't know = about the 'Renner blues' made for the US market (maybe they are<BR>made = with lower tension because of your (American) way with hammer = dopes)<BR>but at least here in Europe the Renner hammers (with Wurzen) are the = very<BR>best hammers available and you find them on Bösendorfers, Bechsteins,<BR>Steinways and  other well known piano makers.<BR>Yamaha uses Wurzen on their CFIIIS and these days even = Samick in Seoul buys<BR>Wurzen felt.<BR><BR>The Renner Wurzen hammers we = use have the following characteristics :<BR><BR>Nice, even tone from the beginning.<BR>Middle section needs some voicing and opening up = (usually around 30<BR>strokes).<BR>Lower bass hammers, usually the first = octave, need battery voicing (driving<BR>up the powers from the base of = the hammers).<BR>Higher treble hammers (from c''' to c'''') need = battery voicing.<BR>The highest treble hammers, usually the last 5 or 6 = hammers, need some dope<BR>to give them a little more 'ping'.<BR><BR>Just yesterday, I voiced an older baby Grotrian Steinweg grand with these<BR>Renner hammers and it took me about 1 hour and 15 minutes = to needle them,<BR>file them, clean them up and apply the = dope.<BR><BR>Result :<BR>A nice, warm and even sounding Grotrian Steinweg baby with a = 'ping' in the<BR>high treble.<BR><BR>By looking closely at the fibers of = the Wurzen felt, and especially on the<BR>sides, we clearly see that = this felt is not just a dense, stone hard,<BR>lifeless piece of felt. On the = contrary, it almost seems like it was woven<BR>like a beautiful = and very expensive Kashmir shawl and after hearing the<BR>result, we can = understand why, in the earlier days, the great piano makers<BR>in Europe used = this felt.<BR>Now that the Eastern part of Germany has been added to = its former halve, the<BR>factory has opened again, continuing to make what = they had to temporarily<BR>stop a long time ago.<BR><BR>friendly greetings<BR>from<BR><BR>Antares,<BR><BR>Amsterdam, = Holland<BR><BR>"where music is, no harm can be"<BR><BR>visit my website at :  = http://www.concertpianoservice.nl/<BR></BLOCKQUOTE><BR></FONT><FONT = lang=0 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff" face="Times New Roman" = color=#000000 size=2 = FAMILY="SERIF"><BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTM= L>