<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN"> <HTML><HEAD> <META http-equiv=Content-Type content="text/html; = charset=iso-8859-1"> <META content="MSHTML 6.00.2600.0" name=GENERATOR></HEAD> <BODY> <DIV> Sorry that was gone on another thread Hello and Happy Birthday, Richard ! I believe the 10mm rule (or conclusion) mean that this dip is the = most comfortable as a generality. May be some very large handed pianists could (if they where aware of) = ask for a keyboard regulation at a different dip/level, but I like the logic to = work with a comfortable dip, and regulate the remaining of the action to = concur. I've never seen a pianist checking the dip, always they check the = aftertouch to see if it please them, most educated then know they can ask for a = little aftertouch change in a little time. I regulated a S&S b last week, that had Abel heads on it. The = heads where too tall, and the tails too long. Working with 10 mm was not an applicable solution (while I tried at = first), as I obtained too much aftertouch, with the long tails the touch became = very bad. But I hade it working at 9.85mm , shanks almost on the cushions, and = that was the less bad I could obtain. If regulated at 9.5 (factory spec) , not enough sound, and an action = that lack responsiveness. Old Schimmel grand's where intended for 10.25 or 10.5, Kaway are said = for 10.25, but if you change the soft punching for better (more firm) ones, = you can regulate to 10 mm dip, and you recognize immediately that you have the = correct touch on these strange actions. Anyway again I discover how much time is lost in regulation when = incorrect parts have been fitted. Regards. Have a nice Sunday Isaac OLEG</DIV> <BLOCKQUOTE dir=ltr style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px = solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px"> <DIV class=OutlookMessageHeader dir=ltr align=left>-----Message d'origine----- De : pianotech-bounces@ptg.org [mailto:pianotech-bounces@ptg.org]De la = part de Richard Brekne Envoyé : jeudi 17 octobre 2002 14:04 À : Pianotech Objet : Re: key dip </DIV>antares wrote: <BLOCKQUOTE TYPE="CITE">I personally have come to the conclusion = that there is actually just one key dip and that key dip is 10 mm sharp, = and no more than 10 mm. All piano makers in the world have a key dip of = 10 mm except the earlier Pleyels, Blüthners and modern Steinways.... = although, when I had my lessons at Steinway the head technician at the = regulation department told me that he thought a key dip of less than 10 mm = on any Steinway was bloody baloney.</BLOCKQUOTE> First off... I have 6 manuals in front of me. 4 of them = official manufacturers specifications. I quote from these for your edification. = Schimmel Grands <BLOCKQUOTE>Over 2 meters --- key dip 10.4 -10.8 Under 2 meters -- = key dip 10.2 - 10.6 Blow ranges from 44 to 46 in the specifications, = and 44 to 48 in the grand requlating guide.</BLOCKQUOTE> Schimmel Uprights <BLOCKQUOTE>Key dip 10.2 +/- 0.2, and 9.9 +/- 0.2 for pre 1985 models. = blow 43 / 46</BLOCKQUOTE> Yamaha grands <BLOCKQUOTE>Key dip 10 mm +/- 0.2. Laroy Edwards gives 10 mm and says = temper this with common sense and a knowledge of action = function.</BLOCKQUOTE> Kawaii Grands <BLOCKQUOTE>Key dip for KG-8 is 11 mm, all other models is 10.5 = blow is 46 -48</BLOCKQUOTE> I could go on and document factory specifications that range from = 9.5 to 11 mm quite easily. Again I must insist that there is no basis for = demanding that the 10 mm key dip has shown itself to be the best. Nor is it true that = all or even the extreme majority of manufacturers specify this. I will go = along with that close to 10 mm is a good norm, and it is indeed the one I choose. = But to declare it as a universal holy grail I will not. Interestingly enough.... David Loves high ratio / low SW = configurations push one rather in the direction of shallow key dip concerns... tho = just barely. But thats the other thread. <BLOCKQUOTE TYPE="CITE"> In regard to making key dip : I had to = train one whole week to learn what a perfect key dip = is.</BLOCKQUOTE>Hmmm... interesting concept... the perfect key dip. Could you describe that = for us in terms of regulating specifications ? <BLOCKQUOTE TYPE="CITE"> After that, when I read about various = key dips, I always feel this urge to open up the magic box and type in the = words I just type in.</BLOCKQUOTE> Heck Andre... agree or not... I respect and admire your advices = and expererience in all things piano ! <BLOCKQUOTE TYPE="CITE">  Most elevated and friendly greetings.....  </BLOCKQUOTE>Likewise Andre :) -- Richard Brekne RPT, N.P.T.F. UiB, Bergen, Norway = <A href="mailto:rbrekne@broadpark.no">mailto:rbrekne@broadpark.no</A> = <A = href="http://home.broadpark.no/~rbrekne/ricmain.html">http://home.broad= park.no/~rbrekne/ricmain.html</A>   </BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>