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<DIV>I think your ears will be much quicker. Cents to beat rates is tricky as it depends on where in the piano you are measuring. Set up the VT with a few different stretch settings from narrow to wide (such as I recently posted on the VT website) and see which one matches what you hear. That will be much faster than trying to calculate it out, not to mention figure in the weighting of how different partial relationships contribute to what you are hearing. For a Wurlitzer spinet the temperament octave should be between a 2:1 and 4:2. A2 will likely be tuned between a 4:2 and a 6:3--probably weighted slightly in favor of a 4:2. Check my Style 1, it is designed for just such instruments. </DIV>
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<DIV>David Love</DIV>
<DIV><A href="mailto:davidlovepianos@earthlink.net">davidlovepianos@earthlink.net</A></DIV>
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<BLOCKQUOTE style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid">
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt Arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B> <A title=mosley@classicnet.net href="mailto:mosley@classicnet.net">pbmosley</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To: </B><A title=pianotech@ptg.org href="mailto:pianotech@ptg.org">pianotech@ptg.org</A></DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> 4/16/2004 2:05:32 PM </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> octave widths</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV><FONT size=2>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>I'm not really looking for the partials of the notes, I am trying to determine the best octave for an individual piano. If there is a lot of inharmonicity, sometimes a 4:2 is too wide for the 2:1. If you know all of the partial values in cents, how would you determine octave widths that fit the best. </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>A2</FONT></DIV>
<DIV>
<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=2 width=174 border=0>
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD width="51%" bgColor=#ffffff height=16>
<P>1st partial</P></TD>
<TD width="49%" bgColor=#ffffff height=16>
<P></P></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD width="51%" bgColor=#ffffff height=16>
<P>2nd partial</P></TD>
<TD width="49%" bgColor=#ffffff height=16>
<P align=right>-6.72</P></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD width="51%" bgColor=#ffffff height=16>
<P>3nd partial</P></TD>
<TD width="49%" bgColor=#ffffff height=16>
<P align=right>-4.52</P></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD width="51%" bgColor=#ffffff height=16>
<P>4nd partial</P></TD>
<TD width="49%" bgColor=#ffffff height=16>
<P align=right>-2.57</P></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD width="51%" bgColor=#ffffff height=16>
<P>5nd partial</P></TD>
<TD width="49%" bgColor=#ffffff height=16>
<P align=right>0.48</P></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD width="51%" bgColor=#ffffff height=16>
<P>6nd partial</P></TD>
<TD width="49%" bgColor=#ffffff height=16>
<P align=right>3.27</P></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD width="51%" bgColor=#ffffff height=16>
<P>7nd partial</P></TD>
<TD width="49%" bgColor=#ffffff height=16>
<P align=right>6.92</P></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD width="51%" bgColor=#ffffff height=16>
<P>8nd partial</P></TD>
<TD width="49%" bgColor=#ffffff height=16>
<P align=right>5.85</P></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>A3</FONT></DIV>
<DIV>
<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=2 width=174 border=0>
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD width="51%" bgColor=#ffffff height=16>
<P>1st partial</P></TD>
<TD width="49%" bgColor=#ffffff height=16>
<P align=right>-1.06</P></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD width="51%" bgColor=#ffffff height=16>
<P>2nd partial</P></TD>
<TD width="49%" bgColor=#ffffff height=16>
<P align=right>-1.84</P></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD width="51%" bgColor=#ffffff height=16>
<P>3nd partial</P></TD>
<TD width="49%" bgColor=#ffffff height=16>
<P align=right>0.33</P></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD width="51%" bgColor=#ffffff height=16>
<P>4nd partial</P></TD>
<TD width="49%" bgColor=#ffffff height=16>
<P align=right>3.1</P></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD width="51%" bgColor=#ffffff height=16>
<P>5nd partial</P></TD>
<TD width="49%" bgColor=#ffffff height=16>
<P align=right>6.88</P></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD width="51%" bgColor=#ffffff height=16>
<P>6nd partial</P></TD>
<TD width="49%" bgColor=#ffffff height=16>
<P align=right>11.36</P></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD width="51%" bgColor=#ffffff height=16>
<P>7nd partial</P></TD>
<TD width="49%" bgColor=#ffffff height=16>
<P align=right>15.23</P></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD width="51%" bgColor=#ffffff height=16>
<P>8nd partial</P></TD>
<TD width="49%" bgColor=#ffffff height=16>
<P align=right>20.3</P></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></DIV>
<DIV>
<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=2 width=174 border=0>
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD width="51%" bgColor=#ffffff height=16>
<P><FONT face=Arial size=2>A4</FONT>
<P>1st partial</P></TD>
<TD width="49%" bgColor=#ffffff height=16>
<P align=right>0</P></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD width="51%" bgColor=#ffffff height=16>
<P>2nd partial</P></TD>
<TD width="49%" bgColor=#ffffff height=16>
<P align=right>1.27</P></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD width="51%" bgColor=#ffffff height=16>
<P>3nd partial</P></TD>
<TD width="49%" bgColor=#ffffff height=16>
<P align=right>4.28</P></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD width="51%" bgColor=#ffffff height=16>
<P>4nd partial</P></TD>
<TD width="49%" bgColor=#ffffff height=16>
<P align=right>9.99</P></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD width="51%" bgColor=#ffffff height=16>
<P>5nd partial</P></TD>
<TD width="49%" bgColor=#ffffff height=16>
<P align=right>15.99</P></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD width="51%" bgColor=#ffffff height=16>
<P>6nd partial</P></TD>
<TD width="49%" bgColor=#ffffff height=16>
<P align=right>23.27</P></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD width="51%" bgColor=#ffffff height=16>
<P>7nd partial</P></TD>
<TD width="49%" bgColor=#ffffff height=16>
<P align=right>31.84</P></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD width="51%" bgColor=#ffffff height=16>
<P>8nd partial</P></TD>
<TD width="49%" bgColor=#ffffff height=16>
<P align=right>41.46</P></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>This is A2 , A3 and A4 from a Wurlitzer spinet, we know all of the information of the partials and can see how much stretch there needs to be. Is there a way to determine the beat rate of any type of octave from these numbers. Is a 6:3 too wide in the tenor, probably, can these numbers prove that. If I tuned a 4:2 octave, what would the beat rate be of the 2:1. It is not the octave type that I need but determining which one fits the best to give me fairly clean octaves. I believe the RCT has some of those capabilities to combine beats and cents measurements into its calculations, but what is the best way to take cents measurements and determine beat values?</FONT></DIV></FONT></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>