<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN"> <HTML><HEAD> <META content="text/html; charset=iso-8859-1" = http-equiv=Content-Type> <META content="MSHTML 5.00.2314.1000" name=GENERATOR> <STYLE></STYLE> </HEAD> <BODY bgColor=#ffffff> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>First, I don't like Lute fisk = either</FONT></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Secondly</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2> <DIV>Sorry for a late response</DIV> <BLOCKQUOTE style="BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: = 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px"> <DIV><FONT face=arial,helvetica><FONT size=2><BR></FONT><FONT = color=#000000 face=Arial lang=0 size=3 FAMILY="SANSSERIF"><BR>I have an off = line question from one of our <BR>European contributors that ties into it.  I = have been thinking about how to <BR>answer him for quite a while but didn't know = exactly where to begin.  Here is <BR>the question: <BR><BR></FONT><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial lang=0 size=2 FAMILY="SANSSERIF">"I = use alot of impact technic that I seen Jim Coleman do on a video.</FONT><FONT = color=#000000 face=Arial lang=0 size=3 FAMILY="SANSSERIF"> = <BR></FONT><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial lang=0 size=2 = FAMILY="SANSSERIF">I think it's Ok to pull up the string with a impact way and then "push the <BR>pin and = hit the key" it down if it didn't sit where I wanted the first time. <BR>This = works well on most pianos but I have trouble with a few brands.</FONT><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial lang=0 size=3 FAMILY="SANSSERIF"> = <BR></FONT><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial lang=0 size=2 = FAMILY="SANSSERIF">[My teacher] wants me to learn to tune the usually way and I suppose he's <BR>right about = that. </FONT><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial lang=0 size=3 FAMILY="SANSSERIF"><BR></FONT><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial = lang=0 size=2 FAMILY="SANSSERIF">The problem is I find it difficult to control the = pin by pushing it up" <BR><BR>I'm sure there are and will be differing = opinions about this but I have had <BR>these same experiences too.  For the = first 10 years I tuned, I used a slow <BR>pull type technique.  Then, I = attended my first convention in Minneapolis in <BR>1979.  There, I saw the = late George Defebaugh RPT and Jim Coleman RPT's <BR>lecture on tuning.  Although I have never see the video spoken of, I assume <BR>it = teaches essentially the same techniques I saw back then. </FONT></FONT><FONT face=arial,helvetica><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial lang=0 = size=2 FAMILY="SANSSERIF"><BR><BR>I went home from that Convention and put = into practice the things I learned <BR>and by doing so, reduced the time it = took me to tune by a very significant <BR>amount and increased my skill level = from far below RPT standards to high <BR>enough to Qualify as an Examiner = Trainee in just two years.  The two most <BR>important elements were the = Pitch Raising Technique and the Hammer Technique. <BR><BR>Even today, I can = try to tell other technicians what I learned then, as <BR>George put it, "You = can tune a piano twice, much faster and easier than you <BR>can fight with = it once" but I still see many who struggle, grunt and groan <BR>their way = through a two hour or more tuning that ends up quite inaccurate and = <BR>unstable.  When the customer is told after that ordeal, "I'll have to do it = <BR>over again in two weeks", the decision is usually made to try = someone else <BR>next time........................................... = </FONT></FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=arial,helvetica><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial = lang=0 size=2 FAMILY="SANSSERIF"><BR><BR><BR>Good luck,</FONT><FONT = color=#000000 face=Arial lang=0 size=3 FAMILY="SANSSERIF"> <BR></FONT><FONT = color=#000000 face=Arial lang=0 size=3 FAMILY="SANSSERIF">  <BR></FONT><FONT = color=#000000 face=Arial lang=0 size=2 FAMILY="SANSSERIF">Bill Bremmer RPT = <BR>Madison, Wisconsin</FONT> </FONT></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Thanks for giving me your time = Bill Bremmer. </FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Jim Coleman has this on a Video = called Aural and visual tunings On the same Video George Defague also shows his = temprement that Martin Store had the beginning of. On this Video Jim and George = also explains partials (if i remember right). the Videos costs only $25  = Take contact with Jim at <A href="mailto:pianotoo@imap2.asu.edu">pianotoo@imap2.asu.edu</A> and he = helps them who be intrested. </FONT></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>I have the same experince as Bill about = Jims and George pitchraising techniques. I can pitchraise and fine tune a piano = in the same day and some times I do a rough tuning in between. The tunings = in the shop sits well  and I can't hear on the pianos  witch one was pitchraised or not. Therefore I have difficults with asking the costumer = for an extra tuning when I need to pitchraise. The prosedure with pitchraising = takes me 20 minutes. I also sometimes pitchraise the piano in a wholescale so I = get the pins in a line as Bill Bremmer earlier has mentioned on the list. = It is also normal in Norway to take an extra appointment when the piano = needs pitchraising. I`ve never done that.</FONT></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>About my impact technic. I think I have = to perfect the normal way of tuning a piano first so I have = something to compare with. I don't trust the impact technique 100% because it = sometimes fools me and I think the hammertechnique Richard Brekne learns me works = better for me now. But for pitchraising I use the impact technique. = </FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>My EPD (Electronic Pitchraising Device)</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>So how do I know how much to = pitchraise? I have a cromatic guitartuner (EPD) that shows me were the pitch is and then I = raise the note about a third above of what it was low. This goes very fast. The = tuner is not precice enough but instead it is very fast and it finds the note = itself, I don't neeed to push any button. My "EPD"tuner has also has a light = arrangement that shows me if I am 5, 10, 15 or 20 cents off.  So It is enough = to look at the lights. I can also do a rough tuning with it. It doesn't hear the = last 1.5 octaves in the ends but there I tune narrow octavs (by ear) = because the piano doesn't move alot in the end of the Soundboard. This tuner from = china costs $30. I can also use it to show a costumer that the piano is very = much out of tune. I use it even if I have an ETD at the shop because it is faster = and it pitchraise the piano as it has dropped..</FONT></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Merry Christmas</FONT></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Ola Andersson</FONT></DIV> <DIV> </DIV></BODY></HTML>