<html> <body> Mr. Stopper, I agree and disagree.  A particularly agreeable old Knabe I tuned had a long attack phase that rose five cents or more.  It was blessedly slow to tune too.  I too check tuning over several volume ranges.  The difference, I use a Verituner that samples over a period of time, measuring and remeasuring a note until it has collected inharmonicity info that does not all occur at once.  Not all boxes are made the same.  I check my concert tunings aurally independent of the box after having put the piano in correct pitch solidly with the box.  Not much tampering after that. ;-)  Andrew C. Anderson At 04:43 PM 1/6/2006, you wrote: <blockquote type=cite class=cite cite="">No they don´t and there are= good physical reasons why they don´t. (You will find not one tuner at Steinway (at least in Hamburg) who is allowed to service concerts with an ETD for example). This has nothing to do with traditionalism or ignorance to modern technology. Most modern ETD´s are doing fast fourier transformation (FFT) for pitch calculation. Be sure, the he ear has no FFT transformator... There is a big difference in what you get measured and what you hear. In some ETD manuals you find sometimes statements of "0.1 Hz accuracy" This is true for a signal that would not float in pitch over more than 2 or 3 seconds to catch enough samples at the current possible samplerates. Piano sounds are a really nonlinear matter that can float in pitch up to some Hz over a second, when strucked firm. By transforming a signal from the time domain into the frequency domain with the desired accuracy (what most ETD´s do), you loose the information when a singal passes exactly what frequency at what time. Tuning with an ETD makes it necessary to tune at low volume levels (Pitch float is less at low volume levels). A good aural tuner tune with a firm struck, to catch also the transient phase of the sound at higher volumes. Low volume tuning is like not voicing the left pedal, it leaves the transient phase untuned. But sometimes it may happen, that the pianist also use volumes above mp...   Bernhard Stopper     Qui habet aures audiendi audiat   <dl> <dd>  <dd>----- Original Message ----- <dd>From: <a href="mailto:tune4u@earthlink.net">Alan Barnard</a> <dd>To: <a href="mailto:pianotech@ptg.org">Pianotech</a> <dd>Sent: Friday, January 06, 2006 10:26 PM <dd>Subject: Re: Cracking the unisons <dd>Yes they do! And just as soon as I finish hemming these curtains and eating my spinach quiche I'm going to come right over there and wag my finger at you. You, you, big meany, you. <dd>  <dd>Alan Barnard <dd>Salem, Missouri <dd>  <dd>  <dl> <dd>----- Original Message ----- <dd>From:<a href="mailto:b98tu@t-online.de"> </a> <dd>To: <a href="mailto:pianotech@ptg.org">Pianotech</a> <dd>Sent: 01/06/2006 3:45:04 PM <dd>Subject: Re: Cracking the unisons <dd>...nor do they use ETD´s <dd>  <dd>  <dd>Bill Ballard wrote: <dl> <dd>Real Piano Men don't use mutes. (you know who you are.......) </dl> </dl> </dl></blockquote></body> </html>