<HTML>Terrry, David, Hazen, Thanks for the posts.  I've tuned many Baldwins, but never one like= this.  That's why I suspected that it was the lack of care that caused= the difficulties.   Terry, come to think of it, it must have been 5 ' 1"; it just looked big= ger than it was because of it's placement in a small room.  I've got to= admit, for a small grand, it sounded pretty good.  If I can convince t= hem to get it serviced regularly, it will end up being really nice.  Ca= n't imagine that I'll be able to convince them to regulate it, though. What I found a bit ironic, is that the prevoius night I'd tuned a 50 yea= r old Baldwin Hamilton Studio that I had tuned back in August.  They pr= obably wouldn't have even called had the bridle straps not been scraping on = the back of the fall board(they had it pushed in too far, so I put some stop= s on it).  The piano was perfectly at pitch, and a dream to tune. &nbsp= ;It went so fast, I threw in a bit of capstan and let-off adjustment for a n= ominal fee(he's a poor music student who appreciates his instrument).   On my way home from that job I was thinking wonderful thoughts about Bal= dwin products, unaware of the alligator that awaited me the next day. Dave in In a message dated 3/22/03 6:30:55 AM Pacific Standard Time, dnereson= @dim.com writes: <BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE style="BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; MARGIN-= LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px">----- Original Message ----= - From: <A HREF="mailto:Piannaman@aol.com">Piannaman@aol.com</A> To: <A HREF="mailto:pianotech@ptg.org">pianotech@ptg.org</A> Sent: Saturday, March 22, 2003 12:34 AM Subject: wrestling an alligator List, Well, it wasn't really an alligator, but when I was done with the Baldwi= n M(5' 8" grand), circa 1965, I felt as if I'd been in a river with a large = reptile.  ON the surface, it seemed like a nice piano, except the lady = told me it hadn't been tuned in probably 20 years.  The husband later i= nformed me that a "cowboy from Oklahoma" was the last guy that tuned it. &nb= sp;Probably told her that it would never tuning again. Anyway, after a pitch raise(only 10% +/- flat in the middle, slightly mo= re at the ends), I grappled with trying to get a decent tuning in it.  = These pianos have no tuning pin bushings, and I guess that's what makes them= want to spring right back to where you started from.  This particular = instrument had pins that popped just as they were about to fall into place, = and voila--10% flat or sharp again!  And it was whiny as a newborn baby= .  Almost as whiny as me right now. I can normally do a pitch raise and fine tuning in  1 1/2 hours or = slightly less if the piano wasn't way off to start with.  I was battlin= g this monster for 2 1/2 hours.  The lady kvetched a bit when I told he= r I was going to charge her for a pitch raise.  Of all da noive! Question:  would regular tuning over the previous two decades have = smoothed out the tuning pin rotation at all?    Amazingly, the piano sounded pretty good when I was done.  I hate t= o admit this, but after that ordeal, I was happy to get to my next customer'= s Pearl River. Dave Stahl    I think the cowboy and the tuning pin bushings are th= e smallest factors and the largest ones are being a Baldwin (tight tuning pi= ns) and the 20 years of not being tuned.  Yes, it would probably be eas= ier to tune if it had received regular tunings over the years, especially fo= r the first few years of its life.  Baldwins still tend to be a bit of = a struggle, but the bushings have very little to do with setting the pin and= the string.  Steinways and probably some other brands don't have them,= either, but its wanting to spring back is due more to never having been sta= bilized at pitch.  --David Nereson, RPT, Denver </BLOCKQUOTE> </HTML>