<html><head></head><body> Farrell wrote: <blockquote type="cite" cite="mid:007f01c08666$961ddea0$bb492041@tampabay.rr.com"><pre wrap="">Thanks for the thoughts Richard.</pre> <pre wrap=""> In this case, I am not entirely convinced at this point that I am looking at a case of loose bridge pins. </pre> <blockquote type="cite"><pre wrap="">As far as lessening of the falseness, you probably achieved a very temporary solution by re-seating the pins. </pre></blockquote> </blockquote> Grin... sorry... of course I meant re-seating the strings on the bridge... this also is the case if you tap the pins themselves a bit deeper into the holes. Rons comments pertaining to the so called "bottoming out theory" and to this string seating buisness jive well with my own experience. <blockquote type="cite" cite="mid:007f01c08666$961ddea0$bb492041@tampabay.rr.com"><pre wrap=""> Reseating the pins? I did not push/tap the pins. I did however seat the strings in every gently way I could think of. </pre> <pre wrap=""> Have you noticed that Ron has not provided input on my recent post regarding how many hours one would charge a client to recap a bass bridge (I did request that no bionic bridge dudes need reply!)? ;-) </pre> </blockquote> Perhaps he was in for a bionic check up .... or too busy with those two preverted posts... you know the ones... "zipping up the fly in public" and " sun bleached tail". grin.... <blockquote type="cite" cite="mid:007f01c08666$961ddea0$bb492041@tampabay.rr.com"><pre wrap=""> Terry Farrell Piano Tuning & Service Tampa, Florida <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:mfarrel2@tampabay.rr.com">mfarrel2@tampabay.rr.com</a> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Richard Brekne" <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:Richard.Brekne@grieg.uib.no"><Richard.Brekne@grieg.uib.no></a> To: <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:pianotech@ptg.org"><pianotech@ptg.org></a> Sent: Wednesday, January 24, 2001 5:21 PM Subject: Re: More False Beats S&S </pre> <blockquote type="cite"><pre wrap=""> Farrell wrote: </pre><blockquote type="cite"><pre wrap="">Tuning a 1996 S&S M today I noticed many prominent false beats in the hi-treble section.....cymbal-tone syndrome.... Gently place rod on top </pre></blockquote></blockquote> <pre wrap="">of bridge pin... False beat does not go away, but.tone dies out real fast, like the string was poorly muted. </pre> <blockquote type="cite"><pre wrap=""> Terry I have noticed the same thing on the Steinway grands, and have yet to encounter that same muting of the sound on other pianos... I really don't know why this is the case... I do know that if you find you can get rid of some of the falseness this way, then CA or epoxy in the Bridge pin holes will help. As far as the cymbal syndrome is concerned... you are not the first person to mention this in relation to Steinways (or other grands with highly active front duplexes) Solution is to redress the capo bar and voice the hammers. You can also get into retuning the duplex... read Ed McMorrows book for some interesting thoughts on this point. He refers to this "cymbal syndrome" of yours to a kind of whistling noise. At least I think you are talking about the same thing... :) </pre><blockquote type="cite"><pre wrap=""> So what happened in the lower half of this section? Why did just </pre></blockquote></blockquote> <pre wrap="">touching </pre> <blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><pre wrap="">(super-duper lightly only) the forward bridge pins cause the strings to </pre></blockquote></blockquote> <pre wrap="">mute </pre> <blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><pre wrap="">out? On the Boston that I posted on recently, as well as many other </pre></blockquote></blockquote> <pre wrap="">pianos, </pre> <blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><pre wrap="">you hear a false beat and when you press gently on loose bridge pin, </pre></blockquote></blockquote> <pre wrap="">false </pre> <blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><pre wrap="">beat is eliminated AND tone remains clear </pre></blockquote><pre wrap="">Don't worry about the muting effect... it wont happen when you CA or Epoxy the Bridge pins. As far as lessening of the falseness, you probably achieved a very temporary solution by re-seating the pins. I like Ron N's position on this seating business... makes a lot of sense. </pre><blockquote type="cite"><pre wrap="">I'm really trying to understand the causes of so much garbage sounds </pre></blockquote></blockquote> <pre wrap="">that </pre> <blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><pre wrap="">emanate from the high treble of pianos (er, a, well thinking of some </pre></blockquote></blockquote> <pre wrap="">other </pre> <blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><pre wrap="">pianos, I guess anywhere on the scale!). Any thoughts on this situation? </pre></blockquote><pre wrap=""> You and just about everyone else. Its fascinating for sure. Lots of sources of diverse types of noise and falseness. As far as the muting effect you observed... I think .... and only think... (as I am but an egg in these matters) that the Steinway bridge and bridge pin configuration is like highly sensitive to changes in mass. Clamp a small vise grips onto a bridge pin on a Steinway and the string goes dead sounding... but on many other pianos there is only a small difference in sound quality. Why this is the case...beats me but I bet the answer is an interesting one. </pre><blockquote type="cite"><pre wrap=""> Terry Farrell Piano Tuning & Service Tampa, Florida <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:mfarrel2@tampabay.rr.com">mfarrel2@tampabay.rr.com</a> </pre></blockquote><pre wrap="">-- Richard Brekne RPT, N.P.T.F. Bergen, Norway <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="mailto:Richard.Brekne@grieg.uib.no">mailto:Richard.Brekne@grieg.uib.no</a> </pre></blockquote> </blockquote> <pre class="moz-signature">-- Richard Brekne RPT, N.P.T.F. Bergen, Norway <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="mailto:Richard.Brekne@grieg.uib.no">mailto:Richard.Brekne@grieg.uib.no</a></pre> </body></html>