<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN"> <HTML><HEAD> <META http-equiv=Content-Type content="text/html; = charset=iso-8859-1"> <META content="MSHTML 5.50.4134.100" name=GENERATOR> <STYLE></STYLE> </HEAD> <BODY bgColor=#ffffff> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Michael, please make the subject line = relate to the content. Not that anyone else does but as a newbie at least start that way. </FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>You don't need to subtract. Just = measure from the hammer center pin to the strings. You can't do that in a grand, the = flanges are under the pinblock. I believe the bore angle is 3* shy of 90* instead of = the 1* in a grand.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Somebody correct me please, and explain = why the difference between a grand and upright. I get to give the technical on = hammer boring at the next chapter meeting.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Keith R</FONT></DIV> <BLOCKQUOTE style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; = BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px"> <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV> <DIV style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: = black"><B>From:</B> <A title=campimichael@hotmail.com href="mailto:campimichael@hotmail.com">michael campi</A> </DIV> <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A = title=pianotech@ptg.org href="mailto:pianotech@ptg.org">pianotech@ptg.org</A> </DIV> <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Thursday, February 27, = 2003 5:09 AM</DIV> <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: Thin Epoxy</DIV> <DIV><BR></DIV> <DIV> <DIV> <P>Hi everyone, I'm a bit new to this thing so forgive me any errors = in protocol. I am attempting to compile a comprehensive body of = information on vertical actions and rebuilding. What I am looking for right now is = any info on objectively determining the bore distance for upright hammers = something along the lines of subtracting one measurement from another similar to = what we do in grands by subtracting the height of the hammer flange center = from string height. So if anyone out there has details on that sort of thing or = any other vertical action geometry stuff I'd appreciate the input. Michael<BR><BR></P></DIV> <DIV></DIV> <DIV></DIV>>From: "Delwin D Fandrich" <PIANOBUILDERS@OLYNET.COM> <DIV></DIV>>Reply-To: Pianotech <PIANOTECH@PTG.ORG> <DIV></DIV>>To: "Pianotech" <PIANOTECH@PTG.ORG> <DIV></DIV>>Subject: Re: Thin Epoxy <DIV></DIV>>Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2003 22:49:58 -0800 <DIV></DIV>> <DIV></DIV>> <DIV></DIV>>----- Original Message ----- <DIV></DIV>>From: "Farrell" <MFARREL2@TAMPABAY.RR.COM> <DIV></DIV>>To: <PIANOTECH@PTG.ORG> <DIV></DIV>>Sent: February 26, 2003 7:54 PM <DIV></DIV>>Subject: Thin Epoxy <DIV></DIV>> <DIV></DIV>> <DIV></DIV>> > I ran across this site and thought of Del and Ron = N. and Ron O. They are <DIV></DIV>>out by Del. The topic of low viscosity epoxies has come = up on the list <DIV></DIV>>often. <DIV></DIV>> > <DIV></DIV>> > http://www.rotdoctor.com/products/product.html <DIV></DIV>> > <DIV></DIV>> > A couple very interesting products: <DIV></DIV>> > <DIV></DIV>> > - CPEST (Clear Penetrating Epoxy Sealer) <DIV></DIV>> > - Tropical Hardwood Epoxy AdhesiveT <DIV></DIV>> > <DIV></DIV>> > The sealer is said to be of diesel fuel viscosity = and penetrates into wood <DIV></DIV>>way more than other epoxies (laminating bridge caps - = your soundboard <DIV></DIV>>coating thing). They also claim that WestSystem is = petroleum based and cures <DIV></DIV>>brittle (I certainly agree that it is brittle).They say = their epoxy is wood <DIV></DIV>>based and cures flexible. I'm not sure exactly how that = might benefit/effect <DIV></DIV>>our work on pianos, but there it is (in a bridge cap, I = don't see where it <DIV></DIV>>would make much difference - brittle or flexible). The penetrating sealer <DIV></DIV>>really gets my interest. Hmmm. Maybe we can laminate a = thin strip of Kevlar <DIV></DIV>>into those bridge caps and use this penetrating sealer = for the ultimate <DIV></DIV>>bridge cap - 'course it might be a bit of work to get a = pin in it and to <DIV></DIV>>notch it. <DIV></DIV>>------------------------------------------------------ <DIV></DIV>> <DIV></DIV>> <DIV></DIV>>I am aware of this product, but have not used it. I've = been just a bit <DIV></DIV>>apprehensive, mostly because I consider the advertising = and promotion, along <DIV></DIV>>with the so-called comparison tests, to be just a = little bit misleading. <DIV></DIV>>Basically, CPEST is a solvent-thinned epoxy resin. The = major difference <DIV></DIV>>between this and other standard structural epoxies is = that CPEST is supplied <DIV></DIV>>pre-thinned. In these 'tests' only its penetrating = capability, not its <DIV></DIV>>structural strength, is being compared, yet the other = standard, <DIV></DIV>>multi-purpose coating and penetrating epoxies have not = been thinned to <DIV></DIV>>anywhere close to the viscosity of CPEST. I suspect = that if the other <DIV></DIV>>epoxies had been thinned out with their appropriate = solvents to the same <DIV></DIV>>viscosity as CPEST they would have penetrated much = better than is indicated <DIV></DIV>>in this test. They would also loose some of their = structural strength, as <DIV></DIV>>does, I suspect, Dr Rot. But this characteristic is not = tested. You may <DIV></DIV>>notice that CPEST is not really being marketed as a = structural epoxy while <DIV></DIV>>the others are. In terms of flexibility, if structural = epoxies such as WEST <DIV></DIV>>System or System Three structural epoxies significantly = they cure to a <DIV></DIV>>somewhat more flexible state as well. <DIV></DIV>> <DIV></DIV>>So, what have we? I suspect that CPEST is a basic = structural epoxy thinned <DIV></DIV>>with whatever thinners are appropriate for the = resin/hardener system and <DIV></DIV>>sold as a thin, penetrating epoxy sealer that is = "strong." Before becoming a <DIV></DIV>>believer I would like to read an independent analysis = of the material. <DIV></DIV>> <DIV></DIV>>Besides, in the soundboard work I've been doing I don't = want the kind of <DIV></DIV>>penetration being described by Dr Rot. These boards are = not rotten, they are <DIV></DIV>>structurally and stiffness impaired. I want all of the structural strength <DIV></DIV>>and stiffness I can get. O.K., within reason. <DIV></DIV>> <DIV></DIV>>Del <DIV></DIV>> <DIV></DIV>>_______________________________________________ <DIV></DIV>>pianotech list info: https://www.moypiano.com/resources/#archives <DIV></DIV></DIV><BR clear=all> <HR> The new <A href="http://g.msn.com/8HMDENUS/2737">MSN 8:</A> smart = spam protection and 2 months FREE* </BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>