evolution/ Horace G's Marpurg I choice

Keith McGavern kam544@ionet.net
Thu, 26 Mar 1998 19:42:53 -0600 (CST)


>...just as I thought, you could not
>support your actions.  I asked the questions the way a lawyer would ask them,
>knowing the answer to each and knowing that you would not have a good answer
>for any of them...
>Bill Bremmer
>Madison, Wisconsin

Bill, B., List,

Why would you ask questions of someone when you already have knowledge of
the answers, and  especially, after declaring prior knowledge that the
person you asked would not have a good answer for any of them?

>From my viewpoint it seems presumptuous on your part to say you know what
lies in another man's heart and mind governing some of their actions and
knowledge, but since you are the one who stated what you did above, I would
appreciate hearing the answers to each of the questions you asked.  Here
they are as you posted early:
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Why would you choose a Quasi-Equal Temperament with 9 pure 5ths only to
have 2 of those which are
noticeably tempered be the very ones which the piece has written more than
any others?  Wouldn't a regular ET have sounded better?

Wouldn't the very wide broken chords and 10ths in B major in the slow
movement in the Valotti temperament have better suited this orchestra that
you say
plays such wide 3rds?  When the piano plays in close harmony in Eb & Bb,
it is mostly solo work.  How could this conflict with the orchestra?  Why would
they play wider 3rds than what they hear from the piano?  The Marpurg I 3rds are
only a little wider than the Eb & Bb in the Valotti.  Why is this such a
better temperament and why would you "not think" of using the Valotti or
any other WT?

Why is it that, as you say, only 3 artists you have ever met could tell which
temperament was on the piano even worthy of posting on the List as a comment?
Is that any reason to make any decision about any temperament whatsoever?
What does this imply?  Should ET be the only choice because in your
experience,  very few could identify which temperament you tuned by name?
Why did you challenge Tom Cole to identify which temperament you tuned?  What
would that prove or demonstrate either way?  He obviously knows ET as his
working temperament and is interested but inexperienced in the HT's.  Why
would you challenge someone to identify something that you would expect him
not to be able to do?

Previously, you made a point of saying that your temperament would definitely
not be Victorian.  Would you please explain to the List why a Marpurg I is
such a superior choice to  Victorian?  Would not the cleaner sounding
Victorian 5ths of all the keys played in the Beethoven 5th have been suitable
to the music?  Why is the atonality of the Marpurg I superior  to the
historically precedented tonal qualities of the Victorian in your opinion?

Did you ask the artist if she wanted ET or a Marpurg I?  If not, do you think
you imposed your judgment upon the artist without asking what she preferred?
If you did not ask, were you afraid that she would say, "no" to what you
personally thought would be a better temperament?  Was it unethical of you to
not tune the piano in ET if you did not get explicit instructions or
permission to do otherwise?  Did you consider the Marpurg I to be the
equivilent of ET?  If so, can an RPT Tuning Exam Examinee use it instead
of ET to take the RPT Tuning Exam?  Can anyone freely substitute the
Marpurg I for
an ET at any time without disclosure of the fact?  Will all artists accept
it?  Will recording studio engineers accept it as an equivilent to ET?

Can you find any historical precedent whatsoever in any publication that
supports your choice of the Marpurg I as being more appropriate to the
Beethoven 5th than either any Victorian or any WT such as the Valotti?

Is your method of tuning based mostly on makeing the piano sound "smooth" to
you as you test intervals chromatically rather than what the tuning would
sound like when actual music is played?  Does the Marpurg I represent to you
the ultimate in the evolution of tuning and temperament?

Why was the pitch at 444?  Wouldn't it have been better to tune at A440 and
use a temperament which permits wide octave stretching such as a WT?  If you
start with your pitch that high, don't you simply create a "contest" with the
orchestra and have to stretch your treble and high treble octaves even
higher?
Does this high pitch really result in making the music sound better?  If so,
do you advocate doing this on every piano so that they will all sound better?
Should PTG and the music industry be looking at changing the international
standard to 444?

I'd really like to know the answers to these questions and I'm sure some
others on the List would too.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Once again, Bill, it is quite confusing to me to request wanting to know
the answers to these questions from another, when you have declared you
already know the answers.

Anyhow, I am one of the others on the List who would like to know the
answers you have presented, and you apparently are the only one who is
professing to know the answers.

Keith A. McGavern
kam544@ionet.net
Registered Piano Technician
Oklahoma Chapter 731
Piano Technicians Guild
USA.





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