In a message dated 7/15/99 12:28:14 PM EST, you write: << When I set the octave to the machine and then do the tests the octave sounds kind of flat or at the very most pure. I'm wondering if others have observed this or I have just been pushing the envelope of stretch so long that I'm used to this more aggressive style. It is most noticeable on low inharmonicity pianos. It seems like with a Steinway there is more room to customize the octaves and the accu-tuner seems to agree with that. >> Your observations are correct and you are doing what most, but not all, tuners do these days. The Steinway piano has more inharmonicity than most other pianos so it lends itself more easily to a wider temperament range octave with 5ths that are less tempered. If you try to tune a low inharmonicity piano such as a Mason & Hamlin, Kawai or Baldwin 7 & 9 foot grand that way, you will have trouble making the same compromise work. Using the inharmonicity to "absorb" the comma is one way of making the piano sound a little better in tune with itself. However, it remains true that if you favor any one interval, octave, 5th, 3rd or otherwise (also double and triple octaves), you will inevitably cause another interval to be more compromised. Therefore, using a lot of stretch in the temperament range will cause your 3rds to beat faster and more harshly but it can help you have less of a problem making the outer octaves sound better in tune and have a more brilliant, better projecting and appealing sound. Using the least amount of stretch in the mid range will make close harmony played there sound much sweeter. If the piano you are tuning will not be used by someone who plays loud, fast and brilliant passages in the high treble but rather close harmony mostly in the middle, you might well not want to see how far you can go with the octave stretching compromises. Dr. Sanderson, the inventor of the Accu-Tuner suggests that an ideal octave in the midrange be a 4:2 octave + 1 cent. That is to say, greater than a 4:2 octave by a small amount. It may, in some cases be a 6:3 octave. I usually use both the 4:2 and 6:3 tests to prove that I have a compromise between the two unless I am going for a minimal or maximal amount of stretch. Here are some comments I made recently in a private post: <<<< I would like to put this question to some friends of me who is very good jazzpianists. Is it possible to ask them this question about stretch? Have I got the right idea about stretch and will they understand the question? >> I think some may understand the concept of stretched octaves and some may not. Some may call it a brighter or a sharper tuning if it is stretched a lot and a duller, softer, mellower or flatter tuning if it is not stretched. One is not necessarily better than the other just as one temperament is not better than the other, each one creates its own effect. <<Other tuners here tend to tune the "A" [minimal stretch], but I like "C" [maximum stretch] the most (Maybe "B" [moderate stretch]in the middle). What do you like?>> I would say that my personal preference is the same as yours and it is preferred by most tuners but some like the "A" or "B" description the best. <<Are there many different wishes here from pianists?>> Yes, and I think that their preferences are about the same as most piano technicians'. You will occasionally meet someone who will deliberately tell you not to stretch the octaves too much. You will also have some, perhaps more, who will make a very deliberate point of telling you they want the upper octaves tuned "sharp". You should do what the artist says in such a case. << Are there different wishes for different styles?>> Generally, for public performances of Jazz and Classical music of the Romantic era, and piano concertos, you would choose type C [maximum stretch]. For early music in a chamber setting, type A [minimum stretch]. For a living room in someone's home, type B [moderate stretch] but you can also choose any type in any situation for special reasons or to comply with a specific request. If you are using a Historical Temperament, you would use type A with the 17th Century temperaments, type B with the 18th Century and type C with the 19th Century. Again however, you can choose differently than the usual, just as you may choose to drink red wine with poultry rather than white and you may have a dry white wine with a steak. It is all a matter of taste and preference. << Am I on wrong track?>> In my opinion, you already have a good and correct idea about stretch. You can educate the customer by telling them that the ear naturally wants to hear pitches sharper, the higher you go on the scale. Because the piano strings have this curious phenomenon called Inharmonicity, where the higher harmonics of every string are very sharp, you can manipulate the tuning to take advantage of this property to satisfy what the ear wants to really hear anyway. Every tuning decision has its consequences, however. Any time you make any given interval more in tune or pleasing to the ear, you cause another to be less pleasing. Tuning will always be an art of compromise. Since the higher harmonics of any string are very sharp, very disproportionately sharp, you cannot favor them except in the very highest range of the piano. They are also quick to decay. This makes them less important than some of the lower harmonics. Since you tune by ear, your ear is probably making the best judgment already. Those who are dependent on Electronic Tuner programs have not developed that judgment.>> The Accu-Tuner can tell you wether the piano you are working on has a low, moderate or high degree of inharmonicity. This can also help you make the decision about how much stretch may be appropriate. I hope this helps your understanding. Sincerest regards, Bill Bremmer RPT Madison, Wisconsin
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