---ric M replies.... > when you sound D4--G4--A4 simultaniously I am wondering how that >would >appear on the music staff?. ..um..it would look like Dsus4. > I question that because I have never heard >that particular chord used to see if it sounds smooth in temperaments. ..the reason for using a sus chord is to test the compatibility of the 4th and 5th(D4-G4 and D4-A4) as they are played together. If one is beating slightly faster than the other, it will show up clearly when played in a sus4 type of chord and you can make a correction based on this test...yes, there is going to be some movement in the 4th and the 5th when tuning in ET, and this sus4 test is suppose to cancel those beats..supposedly, and this is from the person who showed me this(rip), Russian technicians have been using this type of 'test' for a long time. When you do this type of test, all the sus4's should be smooooth. I used D4-G4-A4 as an example..would you like me to use another example, or is it the spelling(God I hope not!) that has you confused? I don't mind being corrected if I am wrong, and will admit that I am wrong if I am, but I spoke clearly when I posted this originally. ric, it is possible that no one questioned me because no one really believes that a sus chord can hold a key to 'tuning bliss'..it's just another test..I use the sus4 test more in the tenor to upper tenor(re:temperament) section of the piano..the beats seem to stand out better there, where as if you use this test in the treble section, you may not hear anything that's wrong, and there may be a problem. The beats don't show up as well in that section. >I have never heard of using >a chord with a major second as tests in temperaments. ..you have now. Think of it as a sus chord..you ARE playing these notes together, aren't you?....Actually, this was shown to me a long time ago(no Tom, not you!!) and I was told at the time that this was an 'advanced' way of listening to 4ths and 5ths being played together..you'll pardon me if I snicker for a minute here( 'roo(k) is doing some shedding!). >There may be a mix up of note naming conventions... ..not this time. > Thus the note we tune to A440 is called A4. So >G4--A4 is a major 2nd. Correct, and when you add the D4 to the A4 and G4, you come up with Dsus4, and consequently, this discussion. All I can say at this point is try it. Tune a temperament as you normally would, then try this sus4 test and see if there is some beating from these chords. If there is, then chances are there's a correction that needs to be made. Check the 4th first, then the 5th, and correct as needed. If anyone reading this is attending the SE Regional later this month and would like a demonstration, I'd be happy to do it at that time. ric, if you don't believe this test is viable and not 'approved', that's fine..different strokes for different folks. I appreciate the fact that you are questioning me and I feel confident that I am answering you in a clear and understanding fashion. Again, I am not looking at re-inventing the wheel, just adding a spoke or 2 to it. side note: I used this Expanded Temperament yesterday to a piano that I have tuned regularly for 2 years now, approximently every 2 months(restaurant setting - 4 nights a week). When I got there, I played my arpeggios and octaves like I normally do and determined that it sounded 'pretty good, it's holding well', but let's tune it using this expanded version..it made a difference in how this piano's sound took shape..and I was very surprised at how 'flat' the top 2 octaves became once the temperament was expanded..they didn't sound 'flat' and hr. ago. It's early, and I need more coffee. ric, keep questioning me..it make me feel like Jim Coleman Sr.(!!)..Larry, I hope you've been reading.. Phil
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