A440A@aol.com wrote: > Inre comparing listener response to temperaments, Richard writes: > > >>It should be noted before going on that all this would do is establish (at > best) > the preferences of the listening group in the most general of senses. It would > explain absolutely nothing relevant to why any such preferences were > observable.<< > > It will also explain nothing of quantum mechanics, viral theory, or > intergalactic time zones, but so what? At this stage of the game, > establishing the preferences of the "listening group" is a valuable piece of > information. I aggree Ed. But as long as we keep the limitations of this right in front of us. Otherwise the exercise can do more damage then good. > It may allow a tuner to chart a course leading to more money > and customers. I think that is worth the effort, in and of itself. Perhaps.... but I think the more important issue is what we can learn about the musicality of the instrument we all seem to be so consumed with. Besides.... grin... anybody can make a buck, and most can probably do it easier then we do.... with or without formentioned addition. > As to "why" these preferences are observable, I submit that to the > listener sensitized to the nuance, the variation of harmonic values in music > is more aesthetically attractive than sameness. I believe that our emotional > sensitivity to the sonic envelope evolved in a non-intellectual(ie, > non-mathematical) environment of sensory stimulation. In this light, ET is an > artificially created compromise arrived at for reasons having little to do > with innate harmonic attraction, but rather, in spite of it. Thats a good submission, and a nice bit of "statement of belief" to follow. But it is exactly this kind of thing we would need to proceed to confirm or refute by more focused testing. > As this > hypothesis is continually tested, and the evidence grows of its validity, the > demands required to contradict it grows, as well, (another damn pun..) It is > a thin rebuttal to say that since it can't be proven, it can't be true. I cant for the life of me see that this "hypothesis" has even been remotely tested. The mere establishing of whether or not the present condition of musicians and audiences leads them to "prefer" one type of tuning situation over another says in itself nothing about the "why" your hypothesis addresses. For that matter we havent even established that much yet, let alone establish whether or not any of this has directly to do with temperaments. > As the preferences continue to exhibit a common bias, (the preferred > sound of a WT piano) from a widening pool of listening groups, it becomes > more and more difficult to offer an alternative (oops, another one) > rationale. This process will continue, and I, for one, am heartened by the > growing evidence that when all else is equal, the WT continues to be > preferred. This is a postulation on your part, and not confirmed. When you have enough hard data to publish on the matter then do so and as time goes by others may follow, or the whole thing can dissolve in front of us for all we know. Untill such time as something is "proven" even in the widest sense of the term... this is all a matter of beliefs and speculations... albiet very interesting ones. I for one, am fascinated... but I am far from ready to hop on any bandwagon of premature conclusions. That doenst make me your fiend now Ed... I just am quiet a bit more the skeptic perhaps. > Regards, > Ed Foote RPT > _______________________________________________ > pianotech list info: https://www.moypiano.com/resources/#archives As a footnote... the first "reaction" is in on the practice grand. The student in question noticed nothing. Only after quite a bit of prodding and fishing for any reaction at all... did he think in directions that finally led him to go up again and "notice" something. I had asked him, finally.... "what would you say if I told you I just tuned the piano yesterday ?".... he then replied that it sounded very "even" and thought I'd done "my usual fine job". But he did go back up... curious now as to what I was up to... and he obviously listened closely to the tuning. He came back and asked if C major was "cleaner" (read *more just*) then other keys. I then told him to follow that thought and continue playing for a few days on the instrument without telling anyone else about it, and without letting any preconceptions get in his way... "just find out whether you find the effect appealing or not" I told him. He left with the comment that he thought it was "stimulating" to try something new. So..... thats all for now... interest yes...after prodding... but not preference established yet, and of course no hint at eventually why. Cheers RicB -- Richard Brekne RPT, N.P.T.F. UiB, Bergen, Norway mailto:rbrekne@broadpark.no http://home.broadpark.no/~rbrekne/ricmain.html
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