How To Choose an ETD was ... something else

[Marcel Carey]

Ok, time to chip in.

I'm all for aural tuning specially for students. This is the way I
learned (no temperament strip) and it was tough but worthwile. Now,
there is another aspect that wasn't adressed. First, I feel that what
make the BIG difference between an experienced tuner and a beginner is
the ability to predict and feel the way the pins will respond. Second,
to me, the unison is still the most important interval in piano tuning.

This being said, I feel there comes a time in a student's learning curve
where the student has to tune as many pianos as possible to get the feel
for the pins and get his stability. I think this is where an ETD come in
handy. The user can focus more on unisons and stability and not worry or
take so much time on octave and temperament tests. For example, if I was
to hire a student and use him/her, I would recommend they use and ETD so
they could tune more pianos and get experience in pin setting faster.
But, I would still do some work without the ETD at least a full day a
week. This way, they could be productive (specially in a school
situation) and still learn at the same time.

But, this is just me...and my french canadian mind working <G>

Marcel Carey, RPT
Sherbrooke, QC



> -----Message d'origine-----
> De : pianotech-bounces at ptg.org 
> [mailto:pianotech-bounces at ptg.org] De la part de John M. Formsma
> Envoyé : 21 mai 2006 15:55
> À : 'Pianotech List'
> Objet : RE: How To Choose an ETD was ... something else
> 
> 
> David,
> 
> I like the way you think!
> 
> In my time of using two ETDs, I found that it did become a 
> substitute for listening. When you have a visual device in 
> front of you with blinking lights, or multi-partial 
> measuring, all the razzamatazz makes you start to wonder if 
> your little ol' ears are good enough. So you start trusting 
> it more and more, 'til you're bowed down in near-reverence to 
> the thing. (Slavery 'twas for me.)
> 
> In my last tryst with my Verituner 100, I was tuning a 
> Steinway D to compare my work with what it calculated. (This 
> was a new piano I'd tuned about 5 times since January, and 
> had recalculated each time, so it should have been the best 
> tuning already. And, I'd just done it a week before this, so 
> it was pretty decent to begin with.) The aural tuning method 
> I chose was open unisons. The temperament was not that much 
> different, but aural was smoother. The treble would have been 
> too flat (and I was tuning in the Expanded Style already). I 
> used every applicable aural test to verify what my ears were 
> hearing. The low tenor would have been just a tad flat in 
> places, and parts of the bass a bit too sharp. It was the 
> best tuning that I've done on that piano, and it "sang" as 
> never before. It was the most fun I've had tuning in a long 
> time. Too busy watching rotating displays before, I guess.
> 
> So I kissed the little machine good-bye, and said thanks for 
> the memories, babe, but I'm moving on. ;-)
> 
> The bottom line is, as I see it, one still must be highly 
> skilled in aural ability to achieve the best results. After 
> all, don't ETD manuals recommend using the ear to verify, and 
> that the ear is the final authority? So, if you're using an 
> ETD, but constantly checking with aural tests, why not just 
> tune aurally to begin with?
> 
> Just my one little opinion. 
> 
> John Formsma
> 
> P.S. I liked this quote so much, David, that I thought I'd 
> just quote it again. "If you're a young (or young at heart) 
> passionate, committed student if piano technology, why 
> wouldn't you want to learn how to use your ears in the most 
> taxing, intimate, and focused way? You would, if you wanted 
> to wring the maximum benefit from your learning.  That's why 
> I believe every serious student of piano technology who wants 
> to be a working, every-day Pianotech will be best served by 
> learning how to tune a piano with ears only."
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: pianotech-bounces at ptg.org 
> [mailto:pianotech-bounces at ptg.org] On Behalf Of David Andersen
> Sent: Sunday, May 21, 2006 1:10 PM
> To: Pianotech
> Subject: Re: How To Choose an ETD was ... something else
> 
> 
> Folks---note the difference; Don says "if used properly,"  Ed 
> says "who starts relying on" the ubiquitous ETD.  And there's 
> the rub: I believe it's up to the individual, and his/her 
> mentor, the degree to which the student, from the beginning, 
> replaces or augments the function of the ear with the machine.  
> 
> If the machine is actually used as a teaching tool---to SHOW 
> somebody visually how close or far they are from ideal, and 
> let their body note that info---then  I say what an 
> incredible tool; what an ear and perception enhancer.  
> 
> If, however, the machine is used as a substitute for
> listening, as something like paint-by-the-numbers, where 
> you're just filling in where you're told to, I believe it can 
> hurt an essential learning function of the students' body and 
> being; further, I think it can---CAN---lead to a steady 
> lessening of the students' ability to truly listen with the 
> whole body in a relaxed way, which, to me, is the fundamental 
> component of doing world-class piano work.
> 
> If you're a young (or young at heart) passionate, committed 
> student if piano technology, why wouldn't you want to learn 
> how to use your ears in the most taxing, intimate, and 
> focused way? You would, if you wanted to wring the maximum 
> benefit from your learning.  That's why I believe every 
> serious student of piano technology who wants to be a 
> working, every-day pianotech will be best served by learning 
> how to tune a piano with ears only.
> 
> I think it's better from a self-esteem or confidence POV as 
> well; you know you can go anywhere in the world, with just 
> you and a lever and a tone source, and tune any piano.  It 
> means something psychologically. The idea is to build your 
> skillset, and the sense of power and accomplishment that 
> comes with that, until you "feel" like a total pro to the 
> world at large, and you can, by telling the truth, hold the 
> reins of most every work situation you find yourself in.
> 
> Just some thoughts on a gorgeous Sunday AM in SoCal.....
> 
> My best to everyone....
> 
> David Andersen
> 
> P.S.  I'M GETTING EXCITED ABOUT ROCHESTER ....OOOHHHHH.....
> 
>   
> 
> 
> 
>