Hammer Types

[David Love]

We were working mostly on the new 175 but did some testing with the 190 with
Bacon felt hammers toward the end of our session.  The current 190 in
production I believe has been modified from the original design which Del
would be more qualified to discuss.  In its current iteration the Bacon felt
hammer sounded great though the Wurzen felt hammer is not a bad choice.  The
Abel felt hammers are a bit too hard, in my view, but they will respond to
voicing.      

 

 

David Love
davidlovepianos at comcast.net
www.davidlovepianos.com 

-----Original Message-----
From: pianotech-bounces at ptg.org [mailto:pianotech-bounces at ptg.org] On Behalf
Of piannaman at aol.com
Sent: Thursday, October 05, 2006 10:12 PM
To: pianotech at ptg.org
Subject: Re: Hammer Types

 

David,

 

Was the 190 one of the pianos in question?  If so, does the Ronsen hammer
soften the tone?  I like the pianos, but they have a tendency to be overly
bright with teh Abel hammers, though the felt seems soft enough.

 

Thanks.  Good report.

 

Dave Stahl




Dave Stahl Piano Service
650-224-3560
dstahlpiano at sbcglobal.net
http://dstahlpiano.net/



 

 
-----Original Message-----
From: davidlovepianos at comcast.net
To: caut at ptg.org; pianotech at ptg.org
Sent: Thu, 5 Oct 2006 9:43 PM
Subject: RE: Hammer Types

I can't speak for Del with respect to using Isaac hammers, I know he did use

them at one time.  However, I just spent the better part of a week with Del

at the Charles Walter Piano Co. in Indian exploring different hammer

possibilities on a couple of Del's designs that they have in production.  I

spent a couple of days setting up three identical pianos with three

different hammers: Abel (relatively soft ones), Ronsen Wurzen and Ronsen

Bacon.  The hammers we chose, ultimately, were Ronsen Bacon felt hammers.

They required no hardening (except for light filing in the treble), and

produced more than adequate power with excellent and broad dynamic range.

It was a great illustration of what happens when soundboard design is

properly matched with hammer weight and density.  

 

Isaac hammers (when unhardened--which they are not always when received) are

similar in density to Ronsen Bacon hammers--perhaps slightly firmer.

Generally speaking, however, the amount of hardener you need will depend on

the soundboard you put them on.  I think you are always better off choosing

a hammer that does not require hardening to begin with (or too much

softening for that matter).  Lacquer is unstable, continues to get hard over

time, and has the potential for locking up the fibers of the felt.  So

looking for a general formula is a mistake, in my view.  How much hardener

you use (if you must) will depend on how the board responds and must be

considered anew with each piano.  I have used Ronsen Bacon felt hammers on

several pianos (some of Del's designs included) where no hardening at all

was needed.  I have also used Wurzen felt hammers on other pianos that were

not nearly dense enough and sometimes too dense.  I have used Renner hammers

on pianos where no amount of needling was sufficient to produce the sound I

was aiming for yet on other pianos they were fine.  When working with

different types of pianos from new ones to those in varying states of

deterioration, having a range of hammers to choose from is vital, in my

view.  I think that it is important to get away from the idea of "one hammer

fits all" which also means to avoid putting yourself in the position of

trying to make a soft hammer hard or a hard hammer soft.  Choose the hammer

with the density and weight that matches the soundboard response from the

start.  While it requires more experience to get a handle on, and/or lots of

sampling, you will have an easier time getting to where you want and the

piano's voice will be more stable over time.  

 

David Love

davidlovepianos at comcast.net <mailto:davidlovepianos%40comcast.net>  

www.davidlovepianos.com <http://www.davidlovepianos.com/> 

 

-----Original Message-----

From: caut-bounces at ptg.org <mailto:caut-bounces%40ptg.org>
[mailto:caut-bounces at ptg.org <mailto:caut-bounces%40ptg.org> ] On Behalf Of
Bob

Hull

Sent: Thursday, October 05, 2006 8:36 PM

To: College and University Technicians

Subject: [CAUT] Hammer Types

 

Caut List,

Along with Chris, I would like to hear some reports

about Ari Isaac's hammers.  Did I read somewhere that

Del uses them?  

 

Also, how does the amount of generally required

hardening compare between the Bacon felt and Steinway

hammers (before they started pre-lacquering)?  

 

Bob Hull

 

--- Chris Solliday <solliday at ptd.net <mailto:solliday%40ptd.net> > wrote:

 

> Rick and list,

>  I have been very pleased with Ronsen Wurzen felt

> hammers and the Bacon felt

> which I use in smaller situations and requires more

> hardener. Also Abel

> Selects sold by Pianotek are similar to the R Ws and

> I have several pianos

> with them on for a couple of years now and they are

> quite durable. Also have

> some with Renner Reds and Hamburg Steinway (very

> much like Renner Reds). I

> never did like Renner Blues much,although I have

> used them and they are OK

> they sound great on a Yamaha C7 in a local studio

> but generally just not

> powerful enough and not much distinction to be had

> between forte and

> fortissimo and sforzando at those levels. I really

> have to work with the

> Renner Reds and hamburgers to open them up. The

> Ronsen Wur and Abel Selects

> are less work with full   dynamic range. LAcquering

> must be done judiciously

> on these types of hammers. I don't recommend keytop

> except at the very top

> if needed. I'm with Rick, we are very fortunate to

> have such a fine array of

> hammers to choose from. I have no experience with

> Ari Issac's where do they

> " fit in?"

> Remember when we only had Standard, Pfreimmer,

> Steinway, Baldwin and then

> the glorious Imadegawas? Holy  cowabunga dudes are

> we lucky.

> Chris Solliday

> ----- Original Message ----- 

> From: <caut-request at ptg.org <mailto:caut-request%40ptg.org> >

> To: <caut at ptg.org <mailto:caut%40ptg.org> >

> Sent: Wednesday, October 04, 2006 2:00 PM

> Subject: caut Digest, Vol 1091, Issue 7

 

 

 

 

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