Laser line for block drilling ? ( Was: Benefits of tilting the piano, instead of the drill press . )

[gordon stelter]

Well, at this point I'm just interested in the pin 
( on a grand ) pointing away from the agraffe/pressure
bar. The right amount. But thanks for the info (What
IS the "right amount", by the way for a no-bushing
grand, like a sTeinway ???) Lowe's DID have a nifty
"Laser Level" for $15 that I might be able to attach
to my drill press base, to cast a  line directly
through the centers of the punched marks on my block
blank, to make surethe pins all line up. And are in
line with the string-line for that section.
    Thanks!
     G

--- ed440 at mindspring.com wrote:

> Gordon-
> Perhaps most important is to be aware that too great
> an angle will cause the string to wind down the pin
> on its own, making it impossible to get tight coils.
> Check the Pianotech archives about this.  Newton
> Hunt made some good posts on the topic.
> Your laser approach would probably work best if you
> arranged it to point to the bridge pins of the note
> you're drilling (assuming the block is in the piano.
>  I think most small shops have adopted some form of
> the small floating press to drill in the piano. See
> the article by Jack Krefting in the PTG Reprints
> book.
> Ed Sutton
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> >From: gordon stelter <lclgcnp at yahoo.com>
> >Sent: Oct 13, 2006 1:05 PM
> >To: Pianotech List <pianotech at ptg.org>
> >Subject: Laser line for block drilling ? ( Was:
> Benefits of tilting the piano,	instead of the drill
> press . ) 
> >
> >  If the drill bit is pointed directly toward
> earth's
> >center, and whatever the press is sitting on is
> flat,
> >and level, the pin holes will all be drilled at
> >exactly the same angle, regardless of which way the
> >body of the press is turned, as it is moved from
> hole
> >to hole. That is very enticing. 
> >     If the far end of the piano is put a little
> lower
> >than the block end, for example, and the block is
> >level to the floor from side to side, the pins in
> >their newly drilled  holes will all lean directly
> >toward the stretcer ( or top, in an upright ) at
> >exactly the same amount. Regardless of whether the
> >drill press was rotated inadvertently, as it was
> slid
> >along from side to side. 
> >     Not so if the bit itself is angled, and the
> piano
> >is level.
> >     Because this uniformity is so appealing, it is
> >why I asked if, in actual practice, pianos are
> built
> >this way? ( With the pins leaning toward the
> >stretcher, but perpendicular in all other planes ).
>   
> >   
> >     Or, instead, do the pins always lean directly
> >away from the string line, regardless of their
> >orientation to the stretcher ? I have a  1923
> Steinway
> >"M" I'm working on. The plate is out and the block
> >still in it, so I'll put some appropriately sized
> >dowells in the holes, and see which it is, in this
> >particular case. Directly toward the stretcher, or
> >toward the stretcher, but modified to keep them in
> >line with the stings? 
> >     Of course, one could keep a whole section
> drilled
> >the same in relation to the string line, such as in
> >the bass section where they're all basicaly
> parallel,
> >but at an angle to the piano's sides, by jacking up
> >one side of the piano, as well as letting the tail
> >down, before drilling. But if one wanted all the
> pins
> >to be exactly in-line with the strings, such as in
> a 
> >"fanned out" section, a line drawn through your
> marks
> >on the block, and some means of registering the
> >already-tilted drill press to that line, while slid
> >along the plank on top of the piano, would ensure
> >this. That is what I was referring to. Perhaps a
> rod
> >secured to the drill press base, with a  couple of
> >small rods hanging staight down from it. Better
> yet:
> >one of those laser-lines now used on many saws and
> >measuring markers. If the laser line was kept
> directly
> >along the 3 drilling marks made on the new block
> for
> >each unison, as the press was slid fore and aft,
> each
> >hole for that unison would be at exactly the same
> >anglre, and directly away from the string line,
> >without leaning from side to side. 
> >     Peace,
> >     G
> >
> >--- Farrell <mfarrel2 at tampabay.rr.com> wrote:
> >
> >> Let me see if I understand you correctly. Let's
> >> start with tuning pins in 
> >> the high treble section of a grand. The strings
> run
> >> roughly perpendicular to 
> >> the stretcher. So the tuning pins will likely
> have
> >> some lean toward the 
> >> front of the piano (keeping the pin close to
> >> perpendicular to the string) - 
> >> and the angle of that lean will form a plane that
> is
> >> perpendicular to the 
> >> plane of the stretcher.
> >> 
> >> Now, if I understand you correctly, your question
> >> arises in areas like the 
> >> low tenor, where the strings angle off toward the
> >> bass side of the piano and 
> >> form an acute angle with the plane of the
> stretcher.
> >> I keep the plane of the 
> >> tuning pin lean one the string line - so that the
> >> pin will lean mostly 
> >> toward the stretcher, but a bit toward the
> treble.
> >> 
> >> I just eyeball it as I drill. I look to see where
> >> the string would go and 
> >> line up my drill to follow the string line as I
> >> stated above. I will do a 
> >> half dozen notes or so and then reevaluate and
> >> change the angle a tiny bit 
> >> if needed.
> >> 
> >> I really don't understand what you are talking
> about
> >> with tilting the piano 
> >> and putting it on it side. Whatever. Just keep
> the
> >> pin lean on the string 
> >> line and lean the pin back so as to keep it
> >> perpendicular to that last 
> >> little length of string as it runs over the plate
> >> toward the tuning pin. 
> >> Actually, I usually lean the pin back a degree or
> so
> >> from that, figuring 
> >> that it may just lean forward a tiny bit on its
> own
> >> - or at least it will 
> >> tend to keep the coil nice and tight.
> >> 
> >> Is that what you were asking about?
> >> 
> >> Terry Farrell
> >> 
> >> ----- Original Message ----- 
> >> >     If you tilt the drill press, and slide the
> >> press
> >> > across the piano on a  plank, and keep the
> drill
> >> press
> >> > base, and arm, perpendicular to the stretcher,
> the
> >> > pins will all lean directly toward the
> stretcher.
> >> If,
> >> > on the other hand, you make sure the arm/head
> of
> >> the
> >> > drill press is perfectly lined up with the
> string,
> >> the
> >> > pin hole will be directly angled away (7
> degrees
> >> or so
> >> > ) from the string. There's a difference. I am
> >> > wondering what manufacturers used which. By
> >> tilting
> >> > the drill press in this fashion, though, you
> are
> >> > risking having the pins angled this way or
> that,
> >> if
> >> > you roatate the press base, at all. Indexing
> lines
> >> > woulds keep your intended results uniform.
> >> >     By placing the drill press on the floor, or
> >> > overhead, and tilting the piano, you eliminate
> >> this
> >> > discrepancy. As long as the bit is "plumb" to
> the
> >> > floor, all the angles will be the same,
> regardless
> >> of
> >> > how the base is rotated.
> >> >     Peace,
> >> >     G 
> >> 
> >> 
> >> 
> 
=== message truncated ===


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