I know what the Vodka is REALLY for.... :-) From: pianotech-bounces at ptg.org [mailto:pianotech-bounces at ptg.org] On Behalf Of Ryan Sowers Sent: Saturday, March 28, 2009 11:11 AM To: David Ilvedson; pianotech at ptg.org Subject: Re: [pianotech] Fixing stripped screws I don't think you can tell what's going to happen with any chemical treatment. Protek seem to work great on some actions; others it doesn't free up the parts enough or its fairly temporary. I've been typically using 50/50 water to denatured alcohol. Its true that it initially seizes up the action and it takes a few hours to dry out. It too have had problems with the centers getting too loose when trying to dry them faster with a heat gun. Darrel Fandrich recommended his new treatment for Verdigris at the California State Conference in Burbank. He's using Ballistol followed by a heat gun. It will smoke so do it outside. (Darrel says he likes the smell) I tried it on an old Mason where every single flange in the action was sluggish (hammers, wippens, jacks and rep levers!) and protek wasn't doing the trick. On an action that needs to be rebuilt anyways I figure there's not much to lose. Kinda like doping a pinblock. The piano went from being unplayable to playing amazingly well! It will be interesting to see how long it lasts. On Fri, Mar 27, 2009 at 7:40 PM, David Ilvedson <ilvey at sbcglobal.net> wrote: I rarely use alcohol/water because I have no idea what is going to happen. Now, maybe, you can enlighten me on the perfect alcohol/water solution...heat? I've got cheap vodka in my car in case Protek/Goose Juice doesn't free up the action. The problem for me is often the action will seize up and need some time to dry (read...overnight...not practical)...light heat from a hair dryer can speed things up but too many times I've had loose centers...most of the time Protek/Goose frees up the action. Vertegri will usually need treatment at every service until new parts. David Ilvedson, RPT Pacifica, CA 94044 _____ Original message From: "Michael Magness" To: pianotech at ptg.org Received: 3/27/2009 10:42:05 AM Subject: Re: [pianotech] Fixing stripped screws On Fri, Mar 27, 2009 at 11:34 AM, Ryan Sowers <tunerryan at gmail.com> wrote: The problem with toothpick and similar repairs is that it doesn't distribute the material evenly around the stripped hole. I thought the paper towel idea sounded promising and I too will try it. It would seem that if you make a small tube of the paper and insert it into the hole it will already have a "pilot" hole. I too have used leather successfully and it does make me feel like more of a craftsman for some reason. Maybe its just because its a good "old school" repair. I also tend to lean towards less toxic repairs. So I prefer to use Ballistol or Alcohol/water over Protek (But I still find myself still using it) for freeing up action centers, and aliphatic resin glue over CA glue. I've often thought that there is a good analogy between drugs and certain chemicals used by piano technicians. They are quick fixes and are highly addictive, but may not have have long term benefit. We may find that all the actions Proteked (a new verb!) in the 90's will start seizing up in the next decade. We don't really know the long term affect of these modern products. -- Ryan Sowers, RPT Puget Sound Chapter Olympia, WA www.pianova.net <http://www.pianova.net/> Hi Ryan, I believe you and I are on the same track. I don't eschew new things for the fact that they are new as much as I question their long term efficacy over the tried and true. Like you I prefer alcohol and water over Protek and Titebond over CA when there is a choice to be made. Of course there are times when Protek or CA are the preferred but I've had the same bottle of Protek for at least 4 years now and it's still over 1/2 full. The only CA I carry is Loctite Gel in a control bottle that allows me to squeeze out one drop at a time. It costs 2.79 at Walmart and I may use 1 or 2 bottles (.14 oz) a year. It's useful for gluing the Kawai Styran, sets faster than PVC-E. I just spent about an hour a few weeks ago re-gluing several hammers in Yamaha's & Kawai's in a high school that had obviously been CA'd by someone previously but were loose again. I removed them, cleaned off the old glue and reglued them properly with Titebond as I always have. CA may work OK in a home setting for a loose hammer but in a school where it's being used 5 or 6 hours a day it doesn't hold up, CA doesn't flex like Titebond will. Mike -- I intend to live forever. So far, so good.. Steven Wright Michael Magness Magness Piano Service 608-786-4404 www.IFixPianos.com <http://www.ifixpianos.com/> email mike at ifixpianos.com -- Ryan Sowers, RPT Puget Sound Chapter Olympia, WA www.pianova.net _____ avast! Antivirus <http://www.avast.com> : Outbound message clean. Virus Database (VPS): 090327-0, 03/27/2009 Tested on: 3/28/2009 11:34:15 AM avast! - copyright (c) 1988-2009 ALWIL Software. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: <http://ptg.org/pipermail/pianotech_ptg.org/attachments/20090328/fb0b6c6a/attachment-0001.html>
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