[CAUT] sostenuto

[Fred Sturm]

On Feb 6, 2008, at 3:54 PM, Kent Swafford wrote:

> You are mixing tests for some reason, Fred.
Yes, sorry about that. I was remembering back to your original post,  
and responding a bit to it as well.
> Let me try to ask my question again.
>
> We think of sostenuto as being either on or off. But the mechanism  
> doesn't work that way. A blade rotates up and down over a distance.
>
> Should we (and pianists) expect full function in the sostenuto when  
> the blade is rotated down a bit from its maximum height? If so, how  
> far?
Yes, a bit for comfort. This partly has to do with the speed one has  
to use in passage work where one needs to change the notes caught.  
Often this is a really rapid sequence:  play the notes to be caught  
for the next harmony/raise both pedals/lower sostenuto pedal/lower  
damper pedal/get the fingers to the next notes. All of this happening  
in a small fraction of a second. So you want a "forgiveness factor" at  
least for grabbing the damper tabs. Now, I'm not so sure you need as  
much of one for "not having tabs pass," and the pianist should be  
expected to keep the pedal fully down from that perspective. But I  
think it amounts to the same, that in fact there will be some play in  
the pedal where tabs won't pass if it is regulated so that you can  
grab tabs in a somewhat large window.
	This is from a pianist's perspective, from the experience of having  
movements where I do quite a lot of what I describe above. But I have  
to add to this that all factors matter: how far up the damper has to  
be before the sostenuto can grab it, how much the key has to depress  
before the damper is raised, height and in/out position of the rod,  
yadda, yadda. There is a relatively small window of what works well.  
There is give, but only a little. It is possible to regulate a system  
so that, from the technician's perspective, it works, but from the  
pianist's perspective it is too unreliable. Of course, if you add  
those old fixed tabs to the mix, there is an even smaller window.
>
> Or should we tell pianists, not to expect to be able to get full  
> function from the sostenuto unless the pedal is fully depressed?
>
> And by full function, in this case, I mean the ability to play a  
> double-forte blow without its tab becoming engaged by the sostenuto  
> blade?
>
> Kent
>
> PS -- You say, "Or play every key hard, but that takes a lot more  
> time and energy."
>
> And then you say, "Ain't no shortcuts."
>
> Exactly.  8^)  Play each of those keys hard!
Well, okay, but I have found that if I have visually inspected, have  
the upstop rail right, and have done the other checking for height of  
the rod, I  never have a problem with dampers passing. So it is  
redundant for me. Might be a good final check to be sure I wasn't  
asleep at the wheel, and might have missed the upstop or something, I  
suppose.
>
> Regards,
> Fred Sturm
> University of New Mexico
> fssturm at unm.edu
>
>
> KES
>
> On Feb 6, 2008 3:50 PM, Fred Sturm <fssturm at unm.edu> wrote:
>
> On Feb 3, 2008, at 7:59 AM, Kent Swafford wrote:
>
> > My tests of the sostenuto were in terms of actual function, that is,
> > as a player. I can see that might not be sufficient.
> >
> > I had hoped someone might have an opinion on safety factor in the
> > depression of the sostenuto pedal. How far could you let up on the
> > sostenuto pedal and still expect tabs not to slide past on hard  
> blows?
> >
> > Kent
>
>        I guess I'd say you want to have to let up "a noticeable  
> amount" on
> the damper pedal before the tabs start to pop (ie, damper pedal down,
> sostenuto pedal down, let up on damper pedal). That's a pretty wimpy
> (imprecise) standard , and one you kind of have to work out on your
> own. The problem is that this symptom (instant popping of tabs, as
> opposed to however much gap) may reveal a combination of things: could
> be the rod is away from the tabs too far, could be too high, and could
> have not enough pedal play (not getting to horizontal), or just a bit
> of two or all three of the above. But it definitely _is_ a good "one-
> stop shopper" first step to see if you have problems. Then you go on
> to find out what the problems are.
>        I guess another wrinkle is to hold the sostenuto at not quite  
> full,
> and press the damper pedal fully, rapidly and see if some pass. Or
> play every key hard, but that takes a lot more time and energy. Here,
> of course, the position of the up-stop comes into play.
>        All things considered, I prefer to go through the regimen I  
> described
> in my earlier post, as it gives me more information in a more
> organized way. Bottom line: you need the rod in about as far as it can
> go safely, you need it to rotate to horizontal, and you need good up/
> down positioning. And you need to have set the stage with an even line
> of tabs, good lift from the keys, and good upstop position. Ain't no
> shortcuts <G>.
>
> Regards,
> Fred Sturm
> University of New Mexico
> fssturm at unm.edu
>
>

-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: https://www.moypiano.com/ptg/caut.php/attachments/20080207/09130775/attachment.html