I completely disagree with Wim assertion that the PTG has reached out to schools and colleges; this has not happened except for the aforementioned single flyer several years ago. This is the kind of misinformation that PTG members rely on to believe all is well. Bill Why are you disagreeing with me. We did reach out to schools and universities, even if it was in 2006, and not very effective, at that. What I am saying to Jeff is that talking to us about how bad schools are treating us, is like preaching to the choir. We know all this stuff. He should send his message to the schools. As I suggested, instead of sending the CAUT guidelines to ALL the schools, can we start by sending them to just the schools that are advertising for a tech, which is only about 6- 10 a year. Most of these schools are "out of the loop", and don't know any better. Maybe if they see what the requirements and pay scales are for experienced and qualified technicians, and how to take care of their instruments, they will do something about it. Wim -----Original Message----- From: Bdshull at aol.com To: caut at ptg.org Sent: Sat, May 8, 2010 2:47 pm Subject: Re: [CAUT] Preaching to the choir; was University of Idaho Piano Tech Vacancy There was and is no PTG outreach to universities. The extent of the PTG effort to educate is to publish a Guidelines document, both hard copy and online. The ways this document reaches the school administrator is either through a PTG member or on the initiative of the university administrator/faculty member. One mailer has been sent promoting the RPT to the university, back in 2005 or so. There is no PTG budget (and absolutely no CAUT Committee budget) for any outreach to universities. Never has been (with the exception of CAUT programs at the Institute, such as the Chicago event 8 years ago. A great event, but drop in the bucket.....) And the CAUT Endorsement proposal, which would "certify" RPTs for university work, and which would be the first real step towards showing that the PTG was serious about reaching out to schools and colleges, is likely to tank in council this year due to the new board's withdrawal of support, the bylaws committee's active opposition, and a general lack of interest among CAUTs. In the meantime, schools continue to disregard any certification at all in the hiring of technicians; "RPT-equivalent" is defined very broadly to mean "CPT" - which is just about any graduate of any course. I completely disagree with Wim assertion that the PTG has reached out to schools and colleges; this has not happened except for the aforementioned single flyer several years ago. This is the kind of misinformation that PTG members rely on to believe all is well. A sound marketing strategy would include the certification of RPTs for specialized CAUT work, the promotion of RPTs to universities and colleges on a regular basis, the promotion of RPT continuing education to all universities and colleges (support for school funding), and the publication and dissemination of a list of unviersities who use RPTs. And far more, the PTG hasn't has a qualified marketing consultant since 1993, we really know better ourselves..... And if the CAUT Proposal stands any chance at all of passing, CAUT members will need to pressure the current board and bylaws committee to reverse their reversal and support the proposal which last year's board worked with the CAUT Committee to present to council. And it would be helpful for CAUT list members to join the PTG-L list and argue the merits of the proposal there, where delegates are more likely to get involved in the discussion. It's amazing to me that we in the PTG are SO individualist and anti-union that we can't see the merits of Jeff's arguments. It doesn't require a union organization to develop a sound CAUT Endorsement, consistently promote the RPT to schools and colleges, publish a list of schools which show professionalism in their hiring of RPTs (including compliance with a minimum staffing and pay standard). At present all we have is a list-serve. It's a great list-serve, but until CAUT PTG members are willing to spare an extra dues dedicated to meeting specific CAUT education, marketing and advertising needs, I guess we should stick to telling Jeff to go back where he came from. Regards, Bill Bill Shull, RPT, M.Mus. CAUT Committee Member La Sierra University In a message dated 5/8/2010 2:27:30 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, davidlovepianos at comcast.net writes: And what should the PTG do? Strong arm universities into raising the pay scale? It's simple supply and demand. There are always enough techs interested in the university positions (for various reasons) that the universities, being generally budget conscious, can find someone to fill the slot. The PTG has no control over the hiring practices of various institutions and it's not their role nor is it within their power under any conceivable circumstances that I can think of. People who ask what the PTG will do for them and don't join because it's not working to guarantee them a certain wage miss the point, in my view. How can the PTG possibly deliver on financial reward for certification? They don't set pay policy nor can they. David Love www.davidlovepianos.com -----Original Message----- From: caut-bounces at ptg.org [mailto:caut-bounces at ptg.org] On Behalf Of Jeff Tanner Sent: Saturday, May 08, 2010 12:14 PM To: College and University Technicians Subject: Re: [CAUT] Preaching to the choir; was University of Idaho Piano Tech Vacancy ----- Original Message ----- From: "Paul Milesi, RPT" <paul at pmpiano.com> > I agree with Ron here. Advancing or promoting the craft is not promoting, > working for, or ensuring particular wages or benefits for our membership. > That is the province of a union, which PTG definitely is not. If we are increasing the skillsets of technicians without promoting that the financial value of those skills is worth more, we leave our members as lambs sent to slaughter when it comes time to negotiate with an employer. As an organization, we have to acknowledge that these skills are used primarily for the purpose of earning a living. If we are advancing skills without also advocating for advancing the financial value of them, then we do a disservice to our membership. The only service we are then providing is to the employers (customers) of our members. If PTG is to be in the business of certifying members, shouldn't there be a financial reward as comes along with similar certifications in other skilled trades? I don't mean setting up a pay scale. I mean things like publishing occasional results of earnings surveys and other data and resources that would be supportive of members who are out trying to negotiate for a paycheck that doesn't qualify them for Medicaid. If they don't hear from us, all they have to go on is the Occupational Outlook Handbook, which doesn't make us look very well compensated. Self-employed technicians find out what the market for their skills is. It isn't difficult to do, and you don't have to ask any member what they charge in order to find out. If you're high, you'll figure it out. If you're low, you'll figure that out too. Customers call around, and they'll tell you exactly what the range is without you asking. But with employees, the situation is very different. About two per state is the average in the southeast. That kind of information is really very difficult to find out unless you're one of few who has kind of kept up with the subject over the years. I agree David, this is the market at work. But its really more like the slave market and our own people are selling us into it. Wouldn't you think our professional organization that we pay dues to would advocate FOR us rather than more on the behalf of our employers? I mean, here is this job posted with an advertised salary that qualifies for Medicaid and the only position our organization can take is, "if you advance your skills, one day you, too can move up to a good CAUT job like this." Yes, PTG provides very good opportunities for educational advancement of its membership. But it has no monopoly on training, and we still have a long way to go to establish the credibility of the RPT certification. Is that all it exists for? If it is not part of PTG's existence to advocate for the financial well-being on behalf of the membership it certifies, then, where is my incentive to be a member? Overwhelmingly, the number one reason I've heard for rejection of PTG membership by technicians is this: "What is the PTG going to do for me? Everything I hear is the value I bring to PTG. I can pay the non-member price if I want to go to a convention once in a while and get the same educational benefit. But what does being a member do for me?" Jeff -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: <http://ptg.org/pipermail/caut.php/attachments/20100508/0bcca536/attachment.htm>
This PTG archive page provided courtesy of Moy Piano Service, LLC