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Re: 'C' fork users only (inferior 'A' fork users need not apply)Did you =
ever check the frequency of the A after starting with a C fork? Becha =
it wont be exactly A=3D440
Dick MT
----- Original Message -----=20
From: thepianoarts=20
To: pianotech@ptg.org=20
Sent: Monday, March 05, 2001 8:44 PM
Subject: Re: 'C' fork users only (inferior 'A' fork users need not =
apply)
Dave,
For clairty, would you summarize your temperment pattern, without =
checks, after you have set the fork into the piano, and established the =
octave with?=20
For example:
>From C-3 - up 3 - Mj. contigious thirds to C-4
>From C-4, down a fifth to C#-3
Etc.
Also, you you list what checks do you commonly use for setting your =
temperment? I am asking, because personally I am slow to introduce new =
checks into my work, as I am a creature of habit, and hope to learn how =
others have refined their temperments.=20
Not too long ago I started using the lovely and useful check for =
a forth: that is comparing the beat rates of the 3 rd. below the bottom =
note (Mj 3rd.) to the 6 made to the top note of the 4th. As you know, =
this test reveals a much more 'countable' difference, compared to 'just' =
the plain forth.=20
Dan Reed
Dallas chapter
on 3/5/01 8:42 PM, Dave Nereson at dnereson@dimensional.com wrote:
----- Original Message -----=20
From: thepianoarts <mailto:thepianoarts@home.com> =20
To: pianotech@ptg.org=20
Sent: Sunday, March 04, 2001 3:11 PM
Subject: 'C' fork users only (inferior 'A' fork users need not =
apply)
Just kidding you overly sensitive 'A' fork users!
Any "C" fork users care to exchange temperment checks and patterns =
etc? I
have been trying to evolve the 'Up three thirds, down a fifth, up =
two
thirds" etc. temperment taught from the Aubrey Willis course 25 =
years ago.
Anyone on the list using this pattern? BTW, after 25 years with =
the fork, I
moved to the Sanderson Accu-fork. It has some advantages. Their =
beat-rater
is also a nice tool for checking contigious thirds.
Dan Reed
Dallas chapter
When I first learned to tune, we were taught a C to C temperament =
that started with a C fork at 523.3 Hz. The drawback to this one is =
that it's across the bass/treble break in many spinets and consoles, but =
the beat rates are a bit slower than an F-F temperament and might be =
easier to hear and count for beginners. It goes thusly:
1. Tune middle C (C4) to fork (523.3 Hz), beatless.
2. Tune C3 to middle C. Tune the A flat below C3 to get a =
countable reference beat, then use the 3rd - 10th octave check =
(3rd slightly slower than the 10th). You can also tune E flat 3 to a =
countable rate and use the 3rd - 6th octave check (both =
intervals should beat about the same rate). =20
3. Tune E3 to C3 a bit faster than 5 bps (beats per second) -- =
"Minneapolis" pronounced slowly, as to a child or =
non-English speaker.
4. Tune G#3 to E3 about 7 bps -- "from Chicago to New York", =
pronounced fairly quickly, as a New Yorker might. Or maybe "I =
don' wanna gohda bed", as pronounced by a recalcitrant tot, knowing =
s/he's gonna miss Star Trek.
5. Check G#3 (A flat) to middle C. Should be about 9 bps. (It's =
real hard for me to call G# to C a Major 3rd when it's really a =
diminished 4th). Make corrections to get 3 contiguous Major 3rds at 5:4 =
ratios, or about a 5-7-9 bps ratio. (I never could =
distinguish smaller than about a half beat per second, so I'm not =
using decimal parts of a beat per second, such as 5.2 or 7.1 bps).
6. Tune C#3 to G#3 (down a 5th) slightly narrow of pure, by 3 =
beats in 5 seconds. I know, this is hard to count, but just =
see that the 5th beats slower than once per second, but not so long as =
two seconds to beat once; then check that C# to E is a beat =
per second faster than E to G#. =20
7. Tune F3 to middle C (down a 5th). Check the 4th with C3. =
Should be wide by a beat per second or so. Check the Major 3rd =
Dflat (C#3) to F3. Should be about 5.5 bps, or 1/2 bps faster than the =
C-E third. Check the thirds F to A flat and A flat to middle C. =
The former should be about 1 bps faster than the =
latter, or about 9 bps and 10 bps, respectively.
8. Tune A3 to E3 (up a 4th), wide by 1 bps. Check the two thirds =
F-A and E-G#. F-A should be about 7.5 bps, or 1/2 bps =
faster than the E-G#. Check the 3rd, C-E vs. the 6th, C3 - A. The 3rd =
should be about 1 bps slower than the 6th (5 bps for the 3rd and =
6 bps for the 6th).
9. Tune D3 to A3 (down a 5th), narrow by 3 beats in 5 sec. Check =
D-F and F-A. D-F should be faster by about 1 bps. or 7 1/2 =
bps for F-A and 8 1/2 bps for D-F. Check the minor thirds C#3 to E3 and =
D to F. Should be 8 and 8 1/2 bps, respectively. =20
10. Tune F#3 to C#3 (up a 4th), wide by 1 bps. Check the Major =
third D to F# (6 bps) vs. D flat to F (5 1/2 bps).
11. Tune B flat 3 (A#) to F3 (up a 4th). Check F-A vs. F#-A#. =
The latter should be faster by 1/2 bps. =
Check D flat to F vs. D flat to B flat. The 6th should be faster by 1 =
bps. Check the chromatic 6ths C-A and C#-A#. The second one =
should be faster than the first by 1/2 bps.
12. Tune D#3 to A#3 (E flat to B flat), down a 5th, narrow by 3 =
beats in 5 seconds. Check D#-F# vs. F#- A#. The latter =
should be 1 bps slower than the former. Check the 4th D#-G#. Should =
beat wide by 1 bps.
13. Tune G3 to middle C (down a 4th), wide by 1 bps. Check E flat =
to G and E flat to middle C. The 6th should be a beat =
per second faster than the 3rd. And check the 3rds D-F# and E flat to =
G. Should increase by 1/2 bps going up chromatically, =
or 6 and 6 1/2 bps.
14. Tune B3 to F#3 (up a 4th), wide by 1 bps. G to B should =
beat about 8 1/2 bps. Check D to F# and D to B. The 6th should =
be a beat faster than the 3rd. Check the 5th E to B. Should be narrow =
by 3 beats in 5 seconds. Admittedly, this is hard to count with =
any 5th, so check E-G and G-B. The minor third should be 1 =
bps faster than the Major, or about 9 1/2 and 8 1/2 bps, respectively. =
Check chromatic thirds F#-A#, G-B, and A flat to C -- =
they should increase by 1/2 bps each. Check chromatic sixths C- =
A, C#-A#, D-B, and E flat - C. They should also increase by 1/2 bps =
each. =20
Then go back and check everything: 5ths, 4ths, Major 3rds, =
Major 6ths, minor 3rds, and make small corrections to smooth things out. =
None of these beat rates are absolute, and will vary slightly from =
piano to piano, but I feel it's a good temperament for learning, keeping =
in mind that it's easier on larger pianos, where you're not setting the =
temperament in the bass/treble break area. Sincerely, David Nereson, =
RPT, Denver =20
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