Fw: Ditch the tuning pin bushings

[David Skolnik]

Dale-
I have a couple of problems trying to draw general conclusions from your 
observations (below) of two pianos, one practically 100 years old and the 
other, 80.  They are, as you say, original stringing.  Surely one would 
expect to see some kind of structural deterioration by this time, no?  They 
probably contain the type of 3ply block to which Del, and perhaps others, 
have referred, however, your examples are not necessarily representative of 
the situation with which we are dealing when confronted with the same 
nominal conditions in a new, or newly rebuilt instrument.  For one, the 
actual amount of pressure being exerted upon the plate webbing by pins that 
have shifted over an extended period, as opposed to those to be found 
present from the beginning, could be quite a bit less.   It's also 
conceivable that the same lose of stability and tunability that could ensue 
from pins pulling forward in an aging block might, in fact, be restored by 
the plate contact.  Compare that with the cumulative effect of an  tight 
tuning pin in a new (5?6? ply) block, with the additional torque from plate 
contact, and without the ability to use forward pin flex to equalize string 
tension.   These are different animals. I'm comfortable with the former, 
not the latter.

Regards,

David Skolnik



At 01:04 PM 05/13/2001 -0700, Dale wrote:
          Del Rons List

        All this talk about plate bushing! We are a bunch of tecn -no geeks.
Del your last paragraph here got me to thinking some more about the stwy
tuning pin plate hole size and how the pins couldn't help but contact the
plate . Sooooo I had to go take a closer look. I currently have two stwy A .
One is a 1906 and the other a 1923 ish.  Both are original stringing. I went
looking to see how many pins contacted the plate flange.  On the larger
holes with the champfer the eldest A had no pins leaning against the flange.
In the low tenor and bass it was difficult to see for sure but it did appear
some did some didn't.  On the newer A even in the top end ther were at least
a couple dozen leaning into the flange and in the bass as far as I could
tell many were leaning.
       O.K. so I've tuned both pianos(and many others) and they tune well.
So that being the case does it really matter that they lean into the flange
some if the tuning stability and ease of pin render doesn't suffer.
Obviously we have all tuned these pianos with great success for years and at
least some of those pianos had more than a few pins touching. Other than
sloppy drilling and the alleged denials from stwy that the pins don't touch
the flange because of design or whatever does it matter?  Would it matter if
they all touched? I wouldn't want them to but now that I've been enlightened
to the fact that all those old stwys I enjoyed tuning were probably similar
to the ones I just described, who cares should we care.The soution for
rebuilders is fit the block and drill carefully.
    I know that we have all been frustrated by the stwy party line,pedantic
style and frustrating parts dept. but I and also remember that I  still get
my best raw materials from them.

    Best

  Dale Erwin
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