more on this temperament thing

[David Love]

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As a general rule I am finding that small pianos require an entry of -.5 =
on the DOB and as the pianos get bigger that number decreases.  But you =
can measure the stretch before you start by tuning a double octave =
(after entering the FAC numbers and saving), and testing aurally to see =
if it is where you want it.  The SAT uses A4 as the fixed point so keep =
that in mind when you choose your test double octave.  I usually try and =
test the double octave to not include any wound strings.  If the double =
octave is too wide, input a negative number on the DOB and change notes =
(step up, step down) to implement the change.  Test again.  When you get =
it where you want it go ahead and start tuning.  When tuning with the =
SAT I start in the tenor and go up (when tuning aurally, I start from =
the temperament and go down).  When I am done with the treble I usually =
direct tune the bass as the machine sometimes has problems across the =
break and I don't always agree with its choices for stretch in the bass. =
 Jim Coleman has made several contributions to the list regarding use of =
the DOB.  I recommend you search the archives and check them out. =20

David Love=20
  ----- Original Message -----=20
  From: Farrell=20
  To: pianotech@ptg.org=20
  Sent: October 21, 2001 11:11 AM
  Subject: Re: more on this temperament thing


  I would sure like to hear more on this topic. As a tuner still on a =
steep learning curve, I wonder just what I should be doing with my =
octaves, but I find that the SAT III is either right where I wish it to =
be, or sometimes I do find that it seems to have calculated a tuning =
with too much stretch, and I have to enter negative numbers in the DOB =
to slow the beating down - occasionally quite a bit.

  Terry Farrell =20
    ----- Original Message -----=20
    From: David Love=20
    To: pianotech@ptg.org=20
    Sent: Sunday, October 21, 2001 11:25 AM
    Subject: Re: more on this temperament thing


    My experience suggests that C8 at 43+ is not a conservative stretch =
but a fairly healthy one.  To my ear, I usually reduce the stretch (on =
the SATIII via the DOB).   On concert grands I seem to prefer it a bit =
under 40.   On smaller grands and uprights, in the mid 30's.  Of course =
the general scaling does make a difference.  But generally I find the =
standard setting on a SATIII over stretches.  I am curious what other =
people find.

    David Love=20
      ----- Original Message -----=20
      From: David M. Porritt=20
      To: pianotech@ptg.org=20
      Sent: October 21, 2001 7:40 AM
      Subject: Re: more on this temperament thing


      Bill:

      You've talked quite a bit of your "tempered octaves" but as one =
who has seen everything from 2:1 octaves to outrageously stretched =
octaves I don't know what kind of stretch you're talking about.  Could =
you give us some numbers so we can know what you mean by tempered =
octaves? =20

      For example, when I tune a Steinway D my C6 is stretched to 5.06, =
C7 is 16.11, and C8 is 43.84.  This is what I consider a conservative =
tuning.  What kind of numbers do you get?  On any piano, just measure =
your C6, 7, & 8 and tell us what model piano it is, and how it stretches =
with your tempered octaves.  That would be very informative.

      Thanks,

      dave
      *********** REPLY SEPARATOR ***********

      On 10/21/01 at 7:19 AM Billbrpt@AOL.COM wrote:
        In a message dated 10/21/01 6:07:55 AM Central Daylight Time, =
davidlovepianos@earthlink.net (David Love) writes:=20



          That being said, if the pianist needs an altered tuning to =
create excitement, he should practice more.


        It's always been my belief, as a piano technician that the =
better prepared the piano, the better equipped the artist is.  Remember =
that I have not advocated *HT* as such for Jazz.  To you, this implies =
*altered* tuning which means something quite noticeably different and =
thus creates an *interference* with what you do rather than provide an =
enhancement.=20

        I don't know if you can or have tried my EBVT but as I have =
designed it (with Tempered Octaves), it is meant to enhance your =
playing, not shock or disturb your musical sensibilities.  It is meant =
to provide definition, texture and clarity, not weird, jarring and =
shocking dissonances.  If the EBVT is still to *altered* for you, I =
believe you might benefit from the Marpurg (also with my Tempered =
Octaves system).  I will give your piano an uncanny clean, crisp and =
clear sound but absolutely will not create any distinction between keys. =


        Bill Bremmer RPT=20
        Madison, Wisconsin
_____________________________
David M. Porritt
dporritt@mail.smu.edu
Meadows School of the Arts
Southern Methodist University
Dallas, TX 75275
_____________________________


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