I have used the method with very good results as well (faster in "fine tune mode, even on a 100 cts PR). A second visit is always in order anyway (don't count on the customer to call back BTW or you'll wait ten more years !) Talking about the VT100 and PR, I'd say it does a good job, but as for RCT one have to have a good understanding of what he does, or he can break string, a feel for the instrument is also useful, as a reflex to rough PR fast without waiting for the display. Best pitch raisers are chipping the piano, takes 10 min once used to that work, I've find that the EDT are more accurate of course and less fast since you get a very good method to use them. Notice also that if the work is done in the shop it can be useful to clamp the bass bridge. BTW when PR a piano, I am expecting the tuning pins and wire to find their "original" place, that is of some help (assuming the piano have been tuned a tad regularly before being neglected) And yes the most neglected pianos are always coming from musician's place , curiously (particular mention to piano teachers)! Cheers. Isaac OLEG I.O. -----Message d'origine----- De : pianotech-bounces@ptg.org [mailto:pianotech-bounces@ptg.org]De la part de Phil Bondi Envoye : vendredi 28 mai 2004 14:57 A : Pianotech Objet : Re: (no subject) - pitch correcting. Farrell wrote: >Gee, over 1,000 resulting posts for "deaf" or "blind" tuning in the >archives. I've spent a half-hour so far and got nothing. Maybe just a hint? > > I'll try to help..although my nomenclature may need some work.. With a piano that hasn't been tuned since(insert your own analogy), go to C5 and turn the R unison pins of all the notes to C8. This is _after_ you get a feel if the piano/pins/wire can handle it..you don't listen to the note..you're just turning tuning pins. I was shown this trick a long time ago by Ken Burton here on Pianotech. I shared it with mentors LB Crabb and John Blick. They thought it was a great idea..then I sat in a Mr. Sadigursky(sp) class at one convention. His class was on pitch correction, and he was doing the same thing. Please note that you don't have to crank the tuning pins..the purpose of this is to get the ball rolling as far as where the pins need to be when you're finished. One or two 'clicks' of the pins(if you're lucky to have those clicks) is all you need. I have gone one step further(i believe..i don't recall Mr. Sadigursky doing this, but I could be wrong)..I now go to the L unison tuning pins also and just slightly move the pins. I do not move them as far as the R unisons..no where near as far..approx. 1/2 as far as the R unisons. What happens, I believe, is there is increased tension at that part of the plate, or, you are 'prepping' the plate. If you're using a Visual Aide to tune/pitch raise and you're tuning/raising from the bass up tuning unisons as you go, by the time you get to C5, the entire plate tension has started to equalize, and the notes from C5 up will be more stable the first time around. This method also works for aural tuners who strip-mute the entire instrument and tune the middle strings first. I've done it both ways, visually as well as aurally with the same results: The treble stays much more stable once you get there and get it in tune. When I pitch-raise using a visual aide(100% of the time now..it's the right tool for the job), I measure where A4 is at..let's say it's -60c. I use the SATll, so after I have that measurement, I get my FAC numbers..keeping in mind the the piano is -60c. Once the FAC's are obtained, I start in the bass, using NO offset..yet. Once I get to the last single wound string note, THEN I offset where THAT note is , and use that until I get to the bass/tenor break where I offset again. I personally do not like pulling bass wire too far above its designated area, and this method has served me well since I was shown this trick/method. As you're working your way up the piano, pay attention to how far from pitch the notes are that you're tuning. I find myself, using this method of 'prepping the plate', offsetting much less as I work my way up the piano. After the bass/tenor break, I may offset one more time around C4 to G4, depending on how flat the instrument is and how the instrument 'feels' to me..and that's as many times as I offset doing a pitch raise..that's it. I am of the opinion that there is no sure fire way to get a piano from -60c to on pitch and stable in one pass..BUT..there are methods to get it to pitch with less work AFTER the first pass. The method I have described(hopefully adequetely) has been my modus operendus since Ken Burton explained it to me here, and I had verification from the Mentors and Mr. Sadigursky's demonstration. There's no sure-fire way to get it done right during the first pass..let's face it..it's been HOW LONG? since it's been tuned, and in 1 hr. you're gonna play Superman/woman and get this instrument at pich AND stable? I don't think so, but the method I have described, with practice/experience, will, in my opinion, make the task of pitch correction much less strenuous and maybe, just maybe, more profitable as you get faster doing it. Your mileage won't vary too much, Phil Bondi(Fl) > > _______________________________________________ pianotech list info: https://www.moypiano.com/resources/#archives
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