Learning was Stretching the Treble

[Vinny Samarco]

Hi Allan,
Thanks for that.  It helps me to know I am on the right track.
Vinny
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Alan Barnard" <tune4u@earthlink.net>
To: "Pianotech" <pianotech@ptg.org>
Sent: Tuesday, July 19, 2005 6:17 PM
Subject: Learning was Stretching the Treble


> Please don't stretch the piano. Unless you intentionally want it a little
> edgy and "brilliant"-which is legitimate but not for new tuners and not
for
> most customers-just listen to the piano and tune it clean. The piano will
> "stretch" itself properly. Coming out of the temperament, most pianos
sound
> good with clean (no beat) double octaves, as David said. These are the
> so-called "4:1 octaves" but it's actually a 4:1 double octave, or
fifteenth.
>
> Here's a trick for learning/testing/tuning the 4:1. Let's say you are
> tuning C6. You want the fundamental tone of this note to be absolutely at
> the same pitch (frequency) as the fourth partial of C4 but you can't play
> C4 while tuning C6, so you have to tuneC6 to C5, right? Well, when you
have
> the C5-C6 octave very clean, hold down C4 (silently, don't play it, just
> lift the damper) and play and hold C6 firmly. This will excite the
> appropriate partial of C4. If it's absolutely beatless, you are right on
> with your C6 at 4:1.
>
> You can't do this all the way to the top because you can't hear it (at
> least, I can't) but it will get you well into octaves 5 and 6. Then, keep
> the pattern going use the 3rd-10th-17th tests to be sure that you are not
> tuning octaves too narrow and listen carefully for clean single octaves to
> be sure you aren't tuning them too wide.
>
> Here is something kind of fun and instructive, I'll use our C6 example
> above: Press C4 down silently and place a mute between the C4 key and
> either B3 or C#4-not the strings; the keys themselves-this let's you take
> your hand off the key while the damper is still lifted. Now you can tune
C6
> without even touching C4 OR C5! Just listen to and eliminate the 4:1 beat
> between C4 and C6. You'll not want to tune this way all your days because
> it takes a little extra time and won't work on anything except pianos that
> are at least somewhat decent and in quiet environments. But, GOOD NEWS,
> these sorts of tricks will help you learn to HEAR the desired octave width
> while just playing the single octave (C5-C6 in this case) with one hand
and
> tuning the top note with the other-check for pure fifths as you go. That
> way, you can quickly tune an octave, then run quick checks with
> double-octaves, 12ths, 10ths (lower tenor), and 17ths (as high as you can
> hear them).
>
> After awhile, you won't have to check everything, every which way, with
> every possible check, every time. You'll learn the SOUND of CORRECT and
you
> will have more and more confidence (and speed) in what you are doing.
> However, you should never abandon all checks because pianos differ so
> widely in inharmonicity, etc., and there are always things that can trip
> you up, like false beats that hit at quirky spots and notes that move
after
> you tune them (oops, it happens to everyone).
>
> And remember, every time you tune one note to another, the second note
will
> only be right IF the first note was right; so when tuning up or down by
> octaves, you can get all messed up. If C4 is a little off in the
> temperament, then you will also have C1, C2, C3, C5, C6, C7, and C8
> wrong-even if you tuned them "perfectly" to each other. This would also
> mess up your P5th checks for all the F's going down and all the G's going
> up. Well, you get the idea: Every now and then, make sure everything is
> working, especially with running 3rds (10ths, 17ths), octaves, and double
> octaves.
>
> Excuse me, but having laid out this stuff to an audience mostly more
> experienced than I, I am going to go hunker in my bunker ...
>
> Alan Barnard
> Salem, Missouri
>
>
> > [Original Message]
> > From: <mps@usol.com>
> > To: <pianotech@ptg.org>
> > Date: 07/19/2005 1:21:18 PM
> > Subject: Stretching the Treble
> >
> > I have been "tuning" for several months now. I know that this isn't
> > very long but there is no sense in continually turning out tunings that
> > just don't sound right in the treble.
> > I feel I have a good enough ear on this matter.
> > I tune aurally and would like to know what partial(s) to listen for to
> > make this stretch sound more accurate.
> > I have no trouble in the bass, only the treble.
> >
> > Thank you for your time
> >
> > Mark
> > Montbriand
> >
> > _______________________________________________
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>
>
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