tuning

[David Ilvedson]

I guess I do a type of whole tone tuning...you could call it whole tone tuning by eye, ear & throat (I mutter a lot)..;-]  I use my SAT III and tune unisons as I go...all my checks are done with tuned unisons...What John mentions below about changes to your tuned notes if making a tension change is so important to remember.   
When I'm bringing my three strings into tune I can instantly see if something is drifting...I tune most unisons with my SAT and then check aurally for movement...usually if I hear an aural problem, one string has moved slightly...of course with the ETD I find unisons where I have to flatten one string and sharpen the other to get a decent unison...inherent string problems.   

I suggest strictly aural tuners at least consider working with a ETD occasionally to "see" what they are missing...

Because of the recent price increases, I am going to have to do with my old flamesuit...so be nice

David Ilvedson, RPT
Pacifica, CA  94044


----- Original message ----------------------------------------
From: "John M. Formsma" <john at formsmapiano.com>
To: "Pianotech List" <pianotech at ptg.org>
Received: 8/4/2006 2:30:07 PM
Subject: RE: tuning


>>Whole tone tuning, when practiced by a good tuner, is incredibly accurate.
>> Whoever made that statement to you is ignorant on the point,  with all
>>due respect. PTG sells a little book by Virgil Smith about tuning that
>>will set you straight, I believe.
>>
>>David Andersen

>[John Formsma] I definitely agree with David here. There's something about
>whole note tuning that actually makes it easier to hear when the note being
>tuned gets in the right place. (It's probably the fact that you have more of
>a solid "foundation" with all three strings sounding together then if only
>the middle string is sounding.)

>Now the caveat is that you have to get your unisons perfect as you go, or
>your octave will be off.  The better the unison, the better the octave. For
>me, tuning octaves is easier to hear this way than with a strip mute,
>although it still takes me longer than with a strip mute.  I like tuning
>with open unisons better because of the better sound it produces.  I think
>it is also more stable.  However, I don't always tune with open unisons.
>Usually just with better pianos that are close to pitch to start with.

>Also, the piano should be fairly close to pitch before trying this.
>Otherwise, there will be pitch drop that will cumulatively affect the rest
>of the piano.  With experience, you can learn to expect pitch drop in
>certain sections, and tune sharper to counteract this.  For instance, today
>I was tuning a piano with the middle section just slightly sharp, and the
>first section of treble was about 6-8 cents flat.  I only did one pass
>through this section, but had to make adjustments to four unisons because
>they had dropped a bit flat.  If you are careful to check your double
>octaves and your octave-fifths, you will catch these before you make too
>much cumulative error.

>I have not read Virgil's book on tuning, but in his classes he teaches to
>get the upper note of the octave just a tad sharp, so there is just a tiny
>beat.  This beat will go away once the unison of the upper note is tuned.

>JF