Hard Hammers

[David Ilvedson]

First of all, I hope we are not talking about Glover's needles.  Now why would hammer fibers be less disturbed from the side?   If fibers are a sort of a tube shape, what difference does it make if you stick a needle in from one side or the other?   Also from the side has more chance of center damage...

David Ilvedson, RPT
Pacifica, CA  94044

----- Original message ----------------------------------------
From: "Gregor _" <karlkaputt at hotmail.com>
To: "Pianotech List" <pianotech at ptg.org>
Received: 4/24/2008 12:07:02 AM
Subject: RE: Hard Hammers



>On the Music Fair Frankfurt I met a collegue who says that the traditional method of 
>needeling which is tought at the German pianotech school in Ludwigsburg is not the 
>best way for voicing. He claims that hammers should not be needled on the 
>shoulder, better is from the side. I can´t explain that very well in English, but 
>imagine the hammer looking from above. Usualy we needle from above and from the 
>under side. He says it´s better from the left and right side for the beginning. Only 
>the final fine work should be done in the traditional way. He argues that the fibres 
>are destroyed by the traditional way. By needeling from the side the fibre 
>interconnection is loosened instead of destroying single fibres. He is writing a book 
>about that and I saw some excerpts in form of some powerpoint presentations 
>where he placed some microscope pictures of fibres and fibre interconnections. 
>Looked and sounded convincing. He constructed a tool for voicing, a special gripper. 
>That is sold by Jahn. On the Jahn homepage you can see a picture:

>http://www.pianoteile.com/

>Look for *Intonierzange E&B Olbrich* at the top on the right side. Jahn writes about 
>THE REVOLUTION in voicing. As far I understood, in the future there will be a new 
>version available which works from 2 sides, i.e. the needles will come from both 
>sides.

>I don´t know if this is really a revolution, but it´s lesser work with that gripper. I 
>think I will order one and try it.

>Gregor

>From: deanmay at pianorebuilders.com
>To: pianotech at ptg.org
>Subject: RE: Hard Hammers
>Date: Wed, 23 Apr 2008 12:39:28 -0400

























>Here is an idea for a needling tool.
>Someone who has too much time on their hands and likes to modify tools could
>build one for the rest of us. 

> 

>What if you took a small air nailer, say
>for brad nails, and modified the end of the piston that pushes the nail head so
>that it would accept and capture a single needle? With a single pull of the
>trigger it should easily fire the needle as deep as you want it to go and the
>spring loaded piston would pull it right back out. The business end of the
>nailer could be set up with an adjustable foot that could control the depth of
>penetration. 

> 

>The advantages would be the ability to get
>lots of deep needle penetration on hard hammers without wearing yourself out.
>It would also probably incur minimal stress on the hammer molding and glue
>joint compared to traditional needling. 

> 

>A hand operated staple gun might also work
>which would give more portability. 

> 



>Dean

>Dean May            
>cell 812.239.3359 

>PianoRebuilders.com  
>812.235.5272 

>Terre
>  Haute
> IN 
> 47802



> 









>From: pianotech-bounces at ptg.org
>[mailto:pianotech-bounces at ptg.org] On Behalf
>Of erwinspiano at aol.com

>Sent: Wednesday, April 23, 2008
>11:03 AM

>To: pianotech at ptg.org

>Subject: Re: Hard Hammers



> 







>  Hi John

>  Petrified felt,  yes indeed a, Paul Bailey coined phrase.

>   I've tried the Dremel many times & find it rather
>useless, but hey they can't be worse. I simply marvel at the lack of interest
>many piano makers have in tone as is evidenced by what they call piano hammers.
>Those who purchased the inexpensive pso simply need the paradigm shift that
>they got a bargain that they now need to invest in to make it a legitimate
>instrument. Like getting a great car cheap that needs a tune up & further
>performance enhancement. Ok....adequate car

>  All our heroic voicing efforts in these cases as I see it.... are not
>our problem.

> I of course, suggest a hammer transplant as usual.

>  A for effort John

>  Dale





>>...then perhaps its your general needling approach that
>needs adjusting.





> 





>Sometimes needles won't work at
>all.  Last week I was servicing a Wurlitzer





>grand with petrified hammers. A needle
>would not penetrate and squeezing





>with parallel pliers felt more like a
>piece of wood than felt.





> 





>I used a damp cloth and an iron on the
>shoulders and a little on the crown.





>This relaxed the hammer enough to be able
>to squeeze the shoulders with





>parallel pliers.  It was still
>plenty loud but the piercing edge was now gone.





> 





>I'm considering voicing with a fine drill
>bit and a Dremel tool on slow speed





>so as not to scorch the fibers. Maybe
>this will create small gaps for the fibers





>to expand into and ease the density.
>It certainly couldn't hurt these HSO's.



>-- 





>Regards,



>Jon Page





> 





>HSO: Hammer Shaped Object















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