[pianotech] Lacquer hammers or stiffen shanks?

Alan Eder reggaepass at aol.com
Mon Feb 7 21:34:49 MST 2011




I may have an opportunity to try that out on a worn out D.  If so, I'll
post the results.

cool.


Alan E.


-----Original Message-----
From: johnparham <johnparham at piano88.com>
To: pianotech <pianotech at ptg.org>
Sent: Mon, Feb 7, 2011 12:07 pm
Subject: Re: [pianotech] Lacquer hammers or stiffen shanks?


Thanks Alan... I think I remember that thread now!

I may have an opportunity to try that out on a worn out D.  If so, I'll
post the results.

Thanks again,
John Parham

> -------- Original Message --------
> Subject: Re: [pianotech] Lacquer hammers or stiffen shanks?
> From: Alan Eder <reggaepass at aol.com>
> Date: Mon, February 07, 2011 1:36 pm
> To: pianotech at ptg.org
> 
> 
> John,
> 
> 
> Bruce Clark gave the presentation.  During the class, he
> made the comment that wooden hammer shanks are not consistent in the
> amount they flex, saying that they vary "wildly."  Composite shanks, on
> the other hand, are very consistent in the amount they flex.  Without
> citing data to back it up, he suggested that a weaker sound may be
> attributable to a shank that is too flexible instead of being a hammer
> issue.  Does that mean that a stiffer shank, such as a composite shank,
> would produce the sound we are chasing using lacquering techniques?  I
> don't know, but it may be worth considering.
> 
> Not too long ago, someone (David Stanwood?) reported that someone else (Doug 
Wood?) had changed the shanks and flanges ONLY on an otherwise well-voiced and 
regulated performance piano (S&S D?).  With the WNG shanks, the same hammers, in 
the same condition suddenly had much more power at their disposal.  Obviously, 
there are many details that I am not sure about, and this is a sample of only 
one, but it is food for thought concerning your comments about energy loss due 
to too-flexible shanks.
> 
> 
> Alan Eder
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: johnparham <johnparham at piano88.com>
> To: pianotech <pianotech at ptg.org>
> Sent: Tue, Feb 1, 2011 3:12 pm
> Subject: [pianotech] Lacquer hammers or stiffen shanks?
> 
> 
> "How likely is it that ALL the hammers of a set (Steinway) would need
> juicing?  I did do the middle section the first time because it  seemed
> a little weak, but left it out of the second application because I
> didn’t want to overdo it."
> 
> Paul,
> I saved some of these posts on juicing because something just didn't
> seem right in the discussion. Now I know what it was: unexplored
> options.  From that perspective, I'd like to introduce a different idea.
> 
> I recently attended the WNG class on top action and back action
> replacement.  Bruce Clark gave the presentation.  During the class, he
> made the comment that wooden hammer shanks are not consistent in the
> amount they flex, saying that they vary "wildly."  Composite shanks, on
> the other hand, are very consistent in the amount they flex.  Without
> citing data to back it up, he suggested that a weaker sound may be
> attributable to a shank that is too flexible instead of being a hammer
> issue.  Does that mean that a stiffer shank, such as a composite shank,
> would produce the sound we are chasing using lacquering techniques?  I
> don't know, but it may be worth considering.
> 
> I don't have plans to test this idea, but I thought I'd throw it on the
> table as food for thought.  Since the composite revolution seems to be
> the next big thing, it's probably worth exploring as we continue to
> explore the limits of our more traditional fixes to recurring issues.
> 
> -John Parham
> 
> > -------- Original Message --------
> > Subject: Re: [pianotech] Nitrocellulose Lacquer: Stirred, Shaken, or
> > Left Alone?
> > From: "Paul Milesi, RPT" <paul at pmpiano.com>
> > Date: Mon, January 31, 2011 8:56 am
> > To: PTG Pianotech List <pianotech at ptg.org>
> > 
> > 
> > Thank you, Al.  I did do a second application last evening on the top two
> > sections of this D, using more like 3 or 4:1.  Also, I did stir the gallon
> > of lacquer this time just to be sure.  Your clarifications are much
> > appreciated!  Thank you.
> > 
> > How likely is it that ALL the hammers of a set (Steinway) would need
> > juicing?  I did do the middle section the first time because it  seemed a
> > little weak, but left it out of the second application because I didn¹t want
> > to overdo it.
> > 
> > Paul Milesi, RPT
> > Washington, DC
> > (202) 667-3136
> > E-mail:  paul at pmpiano.com
> > Website:  http://www.pmpiano.com
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > From: Al Guecia/Allied PianoCraft <alliedpianocraft at hotmail.com>
> > Reply-To: <pianotech at ptg.org>
> > Date: Mon, 31 Jan 2011 08:41:35 -0500
> > To: <pianotech at ptg.org>
> > Subject: Re: [pianotech] Nitrocellulose Lacquer: Stirred, Shaken, or Left
> > Alone?
> > 
> > Paul,
> > 
> > First, it does settle and the lacquer must always be stirred before using.
> > Secondly, you may need to do several applications to get the results you are
> > looking for. Thirdly, sometimes you'll need a 4:1 mix on the last 6 or 7
> > treble hammers.
> > 
> > Al -
> > High Point, NC
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > On Jan 30, 2011, at 11:34 AM, Paul Milesi, RPT wrote:
> > 
> > > I purchased a gallon of ML Campbell clear nitrocellulose lacquer and their
> > > thinner to use to build tone in Steinway hammers.  Since this lacquer is 
25%
> > > solids, per Steinway manual I used a ratio of roughly 8:1 thinner to
> > > lacquer.  One application (hammers thoroughly soaked) did not build tone 
as
> > > I thought it would.  What happened?  Also, wondering now if the solids
> > > settle, and maybe I didn't stir or shake the lacquer before using--don't
> > > remember now.  Does this matter?  Thanks for any ideas.  Still learning 
how
> > > to do this.
> > > 
> > > Paul Milesi, RPT
> > > Washington, DC
> > > (202) 667-3136
> > > E-mail:  paul at pmpiano.com
> > > Website:  http://www.pmpiano.com
> > > 
> > > 
> > >



 
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