Termites...from what I understand, can't live without moisture so they set up camp in areas where they can return to the ground pretty easily for moisture. Without that, they would likely vacate the area in search of moisture. I'm open to correction on that if I'm wrong, but that's what I thought I learned at some point.
Richard
Tropical termites are not the same as the ones found in the Midwest. Tropical termites are not restricted to living underground or inside wood. They swarm and fly and get into anything they want to. That is why they are found in furniture, including pianos. The telltale sign of termites is saw dust in small piles where they have entered the wood. Just yesterday I saw this sawdust on the keybed of a small grand piano in a church. It doesn't take long for them to set up house inside a piano. I had a piano on my lanai, (porch) and termites got into it after it sat out there for only a week.
BTW, I meant to say "treated", not "tested". The termite industry is a multi billion dollar business here in Hawaii. House are tented constantly, (our house was tented before we moved in 4 years ago, but we are asking our landlord to do it again, because we see signs of termites, not to mention other bugs). Furniture is also treated putting in a room and "bombing" it.
Wim
-----Original Message-----
From: Richard W. Bushey <rbushey4 at embarqmail.com>
To: pianotech <pianotech at ptg.org>
Sent: Sat, Oct 27, 2012 1:23 pm
Subject: Re: [pianotech] Opinion on Termite Damaged Piano Requested
Wim,
The customer (military) bought it from anotherfamily here in Waynesville who I assume was also military. So, the currentfamily I'm sure did not have it tested and don't know about the former familywho owned it. As I mentioned before, a previous technician...(the nameescapes me and didn't write it down) in Hawaii noted that an ant colony was"exterminated", whatever that means....and whatever method he used I don'tknow. "Tested" for termites, I doubt.
I'm assuming the damage was from Hawaii but that'swhat's confusing me, the tech notes, if I remember correctly, said antcolony...so now I'm confused. I was assuming that his notes were related to thisdamage, but I guess not necessarily. Hmmm.
Like Ron suggested, I'm not sure how you test fortermites. I guess the customer was in effect asking me to do that. Sheleft it on the carport, on it's back and took the bottom board off herselfbefore she called me. I guess she wanted me to wave my magic wand over itand pronounce it clean...so I did. Hope it is! If not, I'llfind a way to round them up, and send them back to Wim in Hawaii where theybelong. I'll be sure not to use UPS as I want to be sure they arrive safeand sound! : )
I do imagine that the piano is clear of themafter that amount of time, though, assuming the damage was from Hawaii. The woodwas very dry (if they're addracted to moist wood), and no evidence of them inthe wood, (wings, other parts, etc.). The bottom board was made in my shopthen installed in the home, so it's already "home". Termites...from what Iunderstand, can't live without moisture so they set up camp in areas where theycan return to the ground pretty easily for moisture. Without that, they wouldlikely vacate the area in search of moisture. I'm open to correction onthat if I'm wrong, but that's what I thought I learned at some point.
Richard W. Bushey
Richard's Piano Service
www.RichardsPianoService.com
Rbushey at RichardsPianoService.com
573-765-9903
----- Original Message -----
From: tnrwim at aol.com
To: pianotech at ptg.org
Sent: Friday, October 26, 2012 10:34 PM
Subject: Re: [pianotech] Opinion on Termite Damaged Piano Requested
Richard.
This piano had termite damage. I see this kind of damage a lot. Did you ask the customer of the piano was tested before they left Hawaii? If not it would be a good idea to have that done before returning the piano to them. They need to pay for that. Here the mover charges for both moves and the treatment but I get a little discount for the second move.
Carpenter Ants, on the other hand, are a different matter. They don't eat the wood, but leave a black tar substance that is very hard to remove. I have to use a chisel and rag to remove it from keys and key beds or any other surface
Wim
Sent from my iPhone
On Oct 26, 2012, at 3:52 PM, "Richard W. Bushey" <rbushey4 at embarqmail.com> wrote:
Termites or Carpenter Ants? Since pianos from Hawaii and termite damage was brought up, thought I'd share some pics with you. Just replaced the bottom board of this piano just 2 weeks ago. Had ant (or termite) damage back in 2004 and the piano did come from Hawaii. I'm thinking I saw something in the tecnician's notes about an ant colony that was exterminated in 2004. I service Ft. Leonard Wood, Mo. and this was from a military family who must have been stationed in Hawaii at some point.
Anyway, I'm really not sure how they used the piano from then til now, but the pedals were sure in unuseable condition when I found them.
Tilted on it's back, and the bottom board off, there was no evidence of damage in the main case at all, only the bottom board. Why, don't know, but I guess they were very lucky. I inspected the entire piano and saw no evidence of them anywhere else and the piano tuned very well. Boy was I glad. Those critters can sure do alot of damage in a short amount of time! If the damage had been more extensive, I'd likely walked away from the job, but it looked pretty contained.
The pics are in no order, and some who like to look at things really close will be bothered by the fact that in the tilted picture the pedals don't look right, that's because they weren't hooked up yet. Same with one of the pics on the table saw.
Always interesting things to find in this profession. Keeps life exciting!
Richard W. Bushey
Richard's Piano Service
www.RichardsPianoService.com
Rbushey at RichardsPianoService.com
573-765-9903
----- Original Message -----
From: Paul Williams
To: pianotech at ptg.org
Sent: Friday, October 26, 2012 5:14 PM
Subject: Re: [pianotech] Opinion on Termite Damaged Piano Requested
Open one can of worms…then 10 others rear their heads! Sounds like Halloowweeeeenn! Be very careful on this one, buddy! Really a keyframe? Sounds pretty scary!
Maybe or maybe not. I guess a visit first is in order. It might be worth the visit to like or take the job, or run run as fast as you can. You never know. Never take a job on over the phone DAMHIK!!!!
To Wim, I would say run away from it. Termites are damage. They go into everything! Can't even see the extra damage yet until you pull the plate, etc. You should know by now in the land we all like to vacation in! Ahhhh….Hawaii! For the next 6 months, I would love to be there…..Winter's coming in soon buddy! Celebrating 37 today as a high temp! Have to put my Keen's away for the winter and I hate that!
Paul
From: Terry Farrell <mfarrel2 at tampabay.rr.com>
Reply-To: "pianotech at ptg.org" <pianotech at ptg.org>
Date: Friday, October 26, 2012 5:00 PM
To: "pianotech at ptg.org" <pianotech at ptg.org>
Subject: Re: [pianotech] Opinion on Termite Damaged Piano Requested
This isn't my piano - but rather a potential client's who may have me do a belly job on it. He is aware that the keyframe is all chewed up. He has made arrangements for a new keyframe (AHHH!!!).
One thing I do know is that there CAN be major problems. Like a Knabe 6' (or so) grand that I used to service at a hospital. I told them the thing was termite infested. But they didn't do anything about it until one morning when they came to work and found the piano down on the floor (as in not on its legs). The termites had eaten the keybed and the legs broke off.
Terry Farrell
On Oct 26, 2012, at 5:04 PM, tnrwim at aol.com wrote:
Terry
How much are you going to in the rebuilding process? I recently rebuilt a Baldwin F because it was in a fire. But it also had considerable termite damage, especially on the action frame. So be sure to pull the action and check for termite damage, (remove the stack and take off the keys). Other than that you shouldn't have any problems
Wim
Sent from my iPhone
On Oct 26, 2012, at 10:47 AM, Terry Farrell <mfarrel2 at tampabay.rr.com> wrote:
I'm looking for some opinions on the wisdom of rebuilding a 9' Knabe concert grand that has some termite damage. A client of mine owns the piano. I have my own opinion. I'm just wondering what others experience may have taught them.
There appears to be relatively minor damage in several areas of the piano: rim braces, rim, keybed, etc. One can find only one or two smallish galleries in these areas.
IMHO, one would have to pretty much destroy much of the piano to be sure about how much damage there might be.
Presumably the termite activity is not active. The piano was shipped to a fumagation facility and it was gassed in their fumagation chamber. Then the piano was moved back to the home and then the entire home was tented and fumagated. So, I can only assume that if fumagation does indeed work, any termites that were in there are all dead.
Thoughts?
Thanks.
Terry Farrell
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