"New" Hamburg Hammers

[Wolfley, Eric (WOLFLEEL)]

I'm finally seeing all this after much discussion....Perhaps I can shed some
light and set the record straight.

I believe the initial discussion in this thread involved a question about
the difference between Hamburg Steinway hammers and the NY hammers. The
hammers I installed on the piano in question were purchased from Renner USA
and were described by Lloyd Meyer as being "Hamburg" Steinway hammers. These
are not the Renner blues (which I don't like for some reason) but are called
"Renner Gross-6" if you ever want to order some. They are about the biggest,
fattest (12 mm) hammers you can buy, though Pianotek is now selling some
big, fat Abel Concert hammers which are quite similar. I bought these
hammers in a panic because I was due to go to Martha's Vineyard in two weeks
to do a full Stanwood Concert specifications job on this action and the NY
hammers I had ordered 9 months before had not yet arrived (and wouldn't
until 2 months later). In retrospect I'm glad because I love the way this
piano now sounds, but at the time I was not too amused.

The piano in question was a beat-up old 1929 D which was in a rehearsal
space here at the Conservatory that Michael Wathen thought would be a likely
candidate for testing his "Wapin Bridge" invention on a concert instrument.
Don Gibbs (an excellent rebuilder in the Cincinnati area) put in a new
soundboard, and along with Michael installed a Wapin bridge. In this
configuration, the piano sounded quite good and was indeed good enough to be
selected by Barry Douglass over the two C&A  Ds the local dealer had to
offer when he performed with the Cincinnati Symphony Orchestra. The only
complaints about the piano were related to the action. It was heavy, didn't
repeat well and was a bit thin in the upper range. The Stanwood job took
care of all these problems, and then some. It now has a beautiful round
sound with great projection and is capable of very subtle playing as well.
My conclusion after all the attention I have given this piano is that the
Wapin bridge works very well with full strike-weight hammers, and that this
instrument which sits side-by-side with an excellent nearly-new (1999)
Steinway D more than holds its own.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Eric Wolfley, RPT
Head Piano Technician
Cincinnati College Conservatory of Music
University of Cincinnati
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

> -----Original Message-----
> From:	jolly roger [SMTP:baldyam@sk.sympatico.ca]
> Sent:	Sunday, April 15, 2001 3:17 PM
> To:	caut@ptg.org
> Subject:	Re: "New" Hamburg Hammers
> 
> 
> Hi Tim,
>             I'm not so sure of all of the details,  the new piano is NY
> stock so I presume NY hammers. But that may be wrong.
> The 1929 is no longer a Steinway <G> and has, I believe Renner blues.
> I was aware of the various tech's that were involved with various stages
> of
> rebuilding. And am fully aware there are many factors and changes that
> upped the projection and tone pallet.
> I'm sorry if I made light of others work,  but the point I was trying to
> make.  The old piano in the hall was by far the better sounding, however
> at
> the piano bench one gets a different perception.
> I'm not so sure what I'm trying to say, but I would like to hear a
> discoarse on tone, touch, and the perceptions, both in a hall, and at the
> bench. From both players and listeners.
> Things are never quite what they seem.
> Thank's for you comments. I have no disagreement.
> regards Roger
> 
> 
> At 04:26 PM 1/2/70 -0600, you wrote:
> >Roger,
> >
> >I'm not sure what you are saying here.  Does the newer D have NY or
> German
> S&S
> >hammers on it?  Or, are your referring to the Renner hammers as the
> "German"
> >hammers?
> >
> >If you are referring to the Renner Hammers as the German hammers, then
> the
> >reason the older D sounds as it does isn't because of the hammers alone.
> There
> >was a transformation on the older D that was done in stages.  What you
> heard is
> >the tail end of that transformation.  The people who were at UC during
> the
> >first part of the transformation were Rolf vanWalthusen and Michael
> Wathen.
> >Eric Wolfley and Lawrence Becker then came on board and did more
> refinements.
> >To judge this piano on hammers alone is discounting the work done on many
> areas
> >of this piano by several people.
> >
> >Tim Coates
> >University of South Dakota
> >University of Sioux Falls
> >
> >jolly roger wrote:
> >
> >> Hi Don,
> >>             I was in Cincinnati last fall for the Ohio state
> convention,
> >> Lawrence Becker hosted a group of CAUT participant's to share  ideas.
> >> His two prize D's One about a year old, the other a 1929 rebuild with
> full
> >> Stanwood treatment and very high strike weight. Wapin bridge, and
> Renner
> >> hammers.
> >> Both pianos sounded wonderful,  Obviously Lawrence showing off a
> little.
> >> <G>.  Would'nt we all in front of our peers?  Beautiful work.
> >> We had a grad student play the same pieces on the two D's and a Bossy.
> >> (Also ran)
> >> Interesting results.  Most of use preferred the tonal pallet and range
> of
> >> the the old rebuilt D,  from out in the hall.  My immediate comment to
> >> Lawrence, not knowing which was which, " That is not steinway hammers".
> He
> >> just smiled before telling us of the changes.
> >> Talking to the Grad student, however, she much preferred the New D.
> Several
> >> in the group played both pianos, and some changed their minds, once
> they
> >> sat at the instruments and got connected.
> >> A very worth while exercise, and very illuminating about the human
> >> connection of tone and touch.
> >> I hope Lawrence is reading this and will expand on his observations.
> But
> >> you should exchange notes with him,  we could all benifit from the
> dialogue.
> >> For my money the German hammers had a greater tonal pallet, with that
> clear
> >> singing translucent French romantic sound at ppp, so elusive with
> juiced
> >> hammers. Not sure if I'm describing the tone that well.
> >> Please keep us informed of the chapter results.
> >> Regards roger
> >>
> >> At 11:59 AM 4/12/01 -0400, you wrote:
> >> >Hi John,
> >> >
> >> >In January I put a set of Hamburg's on our 22 year old D. (this piano
> >> >was restrung last August, used GC bass strings) Since then, every
> guest
> >> >artist and one piano faculty member have chosen this piano over our 3
> >> >year old NY D. In all fairness to the NY, it is in need of hammer
> filing
> >> >etc. but due to usage that has not been possible this semester. The
> >> >Hamburg hammers have a very nice clarity but less of a tonal palate
> than
> >> >the NY. The pianists that have used the older D preferred the clarity
> >> >and punch. I plan to work on the NY after commencement and then have a
> >> >chapter meeting here to compare the two and analyze the tonal
> >> >characteristics of each. Should be fun.
> >> >
> >> >I also but a set of Hamburg's on an old B in the practice rooms. Same
> >> >tonal situation as above. The students scrambled to sign out that
> room.
> >> >Go figure.
> >> >
> >> >Don McKechnie
> >> >Ithaca College
> >> >
> >