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MessageHi Geoff,
Your luck has apparently been worse than mine. ;-) Yes, when water =
with any ionic content hits a board, you have gizillions of tiny "soft" =
shorts, as you suggest, and that's usually enough to thoroughly confuse =
any logic circuitry. However, if there aren't any static sensitive =
circuits mixed in with high voltage circuits, the device will usually =
only experience "brain drain" and won't get zapped.
About the hard drive, I remember the bad ol' days of hard drives -- back =
in the MFM and RLL days (Might Function Minimally and Run Life =
Limited). I often received a desperate phone call from a fellow grad =
student, wanting me to render aid after a hard drive crash. I would =
always tell the person to shut down the hard drive RIGHT NOW and not to =
run it again until I could get there. The drive would frequently be =
making dragging and scraping noises. Even so, I could still recover a =
large chunk of the data. The drive was only good for perhaps an hour or =
so of runtime after making noise, and the failure was progressive. I =
would always autopsy the hard drive afterwards and find tons of debris =
in it. Modern hard drives don't crash quite so brilliantly as the old =
ones, but I remember recently replacing a 30GB drive in a friends =
laptop. There was not data loss, but the drive was definitely making =
noise, hence my recommendation to back up the data NOW and to order in a =
replacement drive. She used the drive for another couple of days while =
the new drive was on order. It never went "down" but continued to make =
dragging noises (perhaps from a munched head on an unused platter).
The lesson from all of this is that a hard drive can indeed run with =
dust, debris, etc. inside. In fact there is an internal filter that =
catches debris as it is generated during deterioration of the internal =
works. However, when debris is afoot, the drive's life expectancy is =
VERY limited. I'm not saying that there should ever be any reason to =
break the seal on a hard drive. But just the same, if it's necessary, =
it can be done. Just not for long -- just long enough to pull off the =
data.
Having said this, my suggestion was merely to bleed distilled water in =
and out of the hard drive through the filtered ventillation port to =
rinse out the fluids from the inside. I know this sounds awful, but the =
water can all be boiled off at room temperature in a complete vacuum. =
There are lots of people with vacuum pumps, including automotive air =
conditioning service companies and high school physics teachers. ;-) =
Alternatively, take the top off of the platter housing, rinse, and dry. =
Then run the thing open, long enough to recover all the data. Believe =
it or not, I've run dying hard drives open before, just to see them =
work. They could function that way. This would probably be the =
approach I'd take if my HD took a dunk in the toilet.
But then again, THESE THINGS SHOULD ONLY BE DONE BY QUALIFIED, =
PROFESSIONAL DATA RECOVERY PERSONNEL!!! (My disclaimer.)
Peace,
Sarah
----- Original Message -----=20
From: Geoff Sykes=20
To: 'Pianotech'=20
Sent: Saturday, May 21, 2005 1:48 AM
Subject: WAIT! NO! - RE: When your day goes in the toilet
When you get an electronic device wet, for whatever reason, and it was =
turned on at the time, you will be lucky if it lives at all. Almost all =
liquids hold dissolved solids likes salts and minerals and a whole bunch =
of other stuff that is usually conductive. A wet device usually dies =
when power is applied to components that have contacts shorted out with =
these dissolved conductive solids. What happens is the contacts short =
out and delicate components go "paff", kablooie. If this were to happen =
to your TV you would get sparks, smoke and possibly fire. On a cell =
phone, a PDA or a laptop it's just quietly dead.=20
So, on most devices, without hard drives, that were not turned on at =
the time of their dunking, the first thing you DON'T want to do is turn =
it on. What you do want to do is quickly remove the battery, open up the =
device, (carefully), and rinse it out in DISTILLED water. Make sure it =
is ABSOLUTELY DRY, (give it a couple of days), before you replace the =
battery and turn it on again.=20
Now - regarding hard drives. DON'T EVER BREAK THE SEAL! EVER! They're =
sealed for a reason. Hard drives are assembled in a "clean" environment =
and any teensy tiny invisible speck of microscopic dust that gets into =
one will destroy the platter, and your data, guaranteed. The magnetic =
pickups inside a hard disk drive don't actually touch the platter but =
actually ride on an extremely thin wave of air that is created by the =
spinning of the disk itself. Should anything bigger than a molecule or =
so get trapped between the pickup head and the platter it is going to =
act like sandpaper and score the platter making your data absolutely =
irretrievable. Once again, DO NOT EVER BREAK THE SEAL ON A HARD DRIVE!=20
Instead, as a protective measure, back up your data frequently. And, =
should you ever find yourself with a non-functional drive that contains =
data that you absolutely can't live without, find a company that =
specializes in data retrieval. They can retrieve data from almost =
anything. The good ones can probably even retrieve data from a hard =
drive that's been opened. But they're not cheap.=20
-- Geoff Sykes
Assoc. LA Chapter
-----Original Message-----
From: pianotech-bounces@ptg.org [mailto:pianotech-bounces@ptg.org] =
On Behalf Of Sarah Fox
Sent: Friday, May 20, 2005 4:25 PM
To: Pianotech
Subject: Re: When your day goes in the toilet
PS I even resurrected a laptop computer that had a glass of wine =
spilled into it (the computer I'm using now). However, if anything =
liquid gets into a hard drive (which fortunately it didn't), the hard =
drive would need to be replaced.... unless..... to rescue your data, =
at least...
(1) Put the hard drive into a container of distilled water.
(2) Slowly pull a partial vacuum on the hard drive to draw out the =
air inside, and sloooowly release the vacuum. (The water will flow into =
the hard drive through the filtered vent hole.)
(3) Shake water around inside the hard drive.
(4) Remove from the water and slooooowly pull a vacuum again, which =
will cause the water to come back out.
(5) Repeat a few times=20
(6) Vacuum out the water, and draw a hard, prolonged vacuum to =
completely evacuate all remaining water.
(7) Pray to the computer gods.
(8) Reinstall and power up.
(9) Pull your data off of the hard drive and load it onto a =
replacement. Why? The internal debris would have been scattered from =
the filter, so the hard drive's life expectancy might not be so good.
(10) Send me an email to tell me if it worked. :-)
Peace,
Sarah
----- Original Message -----=20
From: Sarah Fox=20
To: Pianotech=20
Sent: Friday, May 20, 2005 7:02 PM
Subject: Re: When your day goes in the toilet
Hi James,
For your Nokia and anybody else's near-flush experience, take =
heart that most electronic devices CAN be brought back to life if you do =
it the right way: (1) Remove batteries. (2) Submerse in a container of =
distilled water. (3) Open the case to expose the insides. (4) Flush =
with a couple more fresh rinses of distilled water. (5) Blow out the =
excess water and let dry (*thoroughly*). (6) Reassemble and power up. =
(Why is distilled water different from tap water? It doesn't have any =
salts in it and therefore doesn't conduct electricity.) I had done this =
several times throughout the years and then ran into some guy who was an =
electronics technician for the Navy. He had used the exact same method =
on a daily basis (and with great success) on equipment that got dunked =
in seawater. ;-)
Peace,
Sarah
----- Original Message -----=20
From: James Grebe=20
To: Pianotech=20
Sent: Friday, May 20, 2005 7:34 AM
Subject: Re: When your day goes in the toilet
Maybe your pocket PC came back, but cell phones do not after =
being dunked in the toilet. I had that experience and when the battery =
gets wet if has a dye that shows it has been wet on the battery and it =
is NOT covered under warranty and the cell phone was unfixable. I had =
to go back to my old cell phone because the new one, though only 1 month =
old it had to be replaced and they could not fix it. I did not have =
replacement insurance. I used to have a Motorola pager and it went =
through the washing machine but after 1 day of drying out it did come =
back. Praise be to Motorola and not Nokia.
Jim
James Grebe
Piano-Forte Tuning & Repair
Creator of Handsome Hardwood Caster Cups, piano benches, writing =
instruments
(314) 608-4137
WWW.JamesGrebe.com
1526 Raspberry Lane
Arnold, MO 63010
BECOME WHAT YOU BELIEVE!
pianoman@accessus.net
----- Original Message -----=20
From: Piannaman@aol.com=20
To: pianotech@ptg.org=20
Sent: Thursday, May 19, 2005 11:32 PM
Subject: When your day goes in the toilet
From the files of "Embarassing but True." If you can't laugh =
at yourself, who CAN you laugh at?
So I finish tuning this lady's piano, and the diuretic effects =
of the morning's coffee kick in. "M'am, may I use your facilities?"
"Yes, no problem." She shows me to the door. =20
I'm wearing my shop apron. Don't know why, probably because =
of the convenient pocket space it affords me to put things like my =
pocket PC in(foreshadowing here...)
Business done, apron back in place--without my IPAQ, which has =
fallen into the (fortunately freshly flushed) toilet. Flushed for most =
of the day were appointments, Tunelab, contacts, and map functions. =20
Things to be thankful for:=20
My wonderful wife, who offered me personalized GPS service via =
my cell phone from her job at the university.
I tune mostly by ear, anyway. (4 of the five jobs consisted =
of lowering the pitch on new pianos, 2 by over 20 cents each).
Since my day was so busy, I'd made out all of today's invoices =
in advance, so at least I had everyone's address handy.
SD cards, which saved EVERYTHING today.
Water dries out.
Computers can come back from a dunking.=20
It's been a long day. Time for a glass o' vino.
Dave Stahl
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