> This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand this format, some or all of this message may not be legible. ---------------------- multipart/alternative attachment Dave, For clairty, would you summarize your temperment pattern, without checks, after you have set the fork into the piano, and established the octave with? For example: >From C-3 - up 3 - Mj. contigious thirds to C-4 >From C-4, down a fifth to C#-3 Etc. Also, you you list what checks do you commonly use for setting your temperment? I am asking, because personally I am slow to introduce new checks into my work, as I am a creature of habit, and hope to learn how others have refined their temperments. Not too long ago I started using the lovely and useful check for a forth: that is comparing the beat rates of the 3 rd. below the bottom note (Mj 3rd.) to the 6 made to the top note of the 4th. As you know, this test reveals a much more 'countable' difference, compared to 'just' the plain forth. Dan Reed Dallas chapter on 3/5/01 8:42 PM, Dave Nereson at dnereson@dimensional.com wrote: ----- Original Message ----- From: thepianoarts <mailto:thepianoarts@home.com> To: pianotech@ptg.org Sent: Sunday, March 04, 2001 3:11 PM Subject: 'C' fork users only (inferior 'A' fork users need not apply) Just kidding you overly sensitive 'A' fork users! Any "C" fork users care to exchange temperment checks and patterns etc? I have been trying to evolve the 'Up three thirds, down a fifth, up two thirds" etc. temperment taught from the Aubrey Willis course 25 years ago. Anyone on the list using this pattern? BTW, after 25 years with the fork, I moved to the Sanderson Accu-fork. It has some advantages. Their beat-rater is also a nice tool for checking contigious thirds. Dan Reed Dallas chapter When I first learned to tune, we were taught a C to C temperament that started with a C fork at 523.3 Hz. The drawback to this one is that it's across the bass/treble break in many spinets and consoles, but the beat rates are a bit slower than an F-F temperament and might be easier to hear and count for beginners. It goes thusly: 1. Tune middle C (C4) to fork (523.3 Hz), beatless. 2. Tune C3 to middle C. Tune the A flat below C3 to get a countable reference beat, then use the 3rd - 10th octave check (3rd slightly slower than the 10th). You can also tune E flat 3 to a countable rate and use the 3rd - 6th octave check (both intervals should beat about the same rate). 3. Tune E3 to C3 a bit faster than 5 bps (beats per second) -- "Minneapolis" pronounced slowly, as to a child or non-English speaker. 4. Tune G#3 to E3 about 7 bps -- "from Chicago to New York", pronounced fairly quickly, as a New Yorker might. Or maybe "I don' wanna gohda bed", as pronounced by a recalcitrant tot, knowing s/he's gonna miss Star Trek. 5. Check G#3 (A flat) to middle C. Should be about 9 bps. (It's real hard for me to call G# to C a Major 3rd when it's really a diminished 4th). Make corrections to get 3 contiguous Major 3rds at 5:4 ratios, or about a 5-7-9 bps ratio. (I never could distinguish smaller than about a half beat per second, so I'm not using decimal parts of a beat per second, such as 5.2 or 7.1 bps). 6. Tune C#3 to G#3 (down a 5th) slightly narrow of pure, by 3 beats in 5 seconds. I know, this is hard to count, but just see that the 5th beats slower than once per second, but not so long as two seconds to beat once; then check that C# to E is a beat per second faster than E to G#. 7. Tune F3 to middle C (down a 5th). Check the 4th with C3. Should be wide by a beat per second or so. Check the Major 3rd Dflat (C#3) to F3. Should be about 5.5 bps, or 1/2 bps faster than the C-E third. Check the thirds F to A flat and A flat to middle C. The former should be about 1 bps faster than the latter, or about 9 bps and 10 bps, respectively. 8. Tune A3 to E3 (up a 4th), wide by 1 bps. Check the two thirds F-A and E-G#. F-A should be about 7.5 bps, or 1/2 bps faster than the E-G#. Check the 3rd, C-E vs. the 6th, C3 - A. The 3rd should be about 1 bps slower than the 6th (5 bps for the 3rd and 6 bps for the 6th). 9. Tune D3 to A3 (down a 5th), narrow by 3 beats in 5 sec. Check D-F and F-A. D-F should be faster by about 1 bps. or 7 1/2 bps for F-A and 8 1/2 bps for D-F. Check the minor thirds C#3 to E3 and D to F. Should be 8 and 8 1/2 bps, respectively. 10. Tune F#3 to C#3 (up a 4th), wide by 1 bps. Check the Major third D to F# (6 bps) vs. D flat to F (5 1/2 bps). 11. Tune B flat 3 (A#) to F3 (up a 4th). Check F-A vs. F#-A#. The latter should be faster by 1/2 bps. Check D flat to F vs. D flat to B flat. The 6th should be faster by 1 bps. Check the chromatic 6ths C-A and C#-A#. The second one should be faster than the first by 1/2 bps. 12. Tune D#3 to A#3 (E flat to B flat), down a 5th, narrow by 3 beats in 5 seconds. Check D#-F# vs. F#- A#. The latter should be 1 bps slower than the former. Check the 4th D#-G#. Should beat wide by 1 bps. 13. Tune G3 to middle C (down a 4th), wide by 1 bps. Check E flat to G and E flat to middle C. The 6th should be a beat per second faster than the 3rd. And check the 3rds D-F# and E flat to G. Should increase by 1/2 bps going up chromatically, or 6 and 6 1/2 bps. 14. Tune B3 to F#3 (up a 4th), wide by 1 bps. G to B should beat about 8 1/2 bps. Check D to F# and D to B. The 6th should be a beat faster than the 3rd. Check the 5th E to B. Should be narrow by 3 beats in 5 seconds. Admittedly, this is hard to count with any 5th, so check E-G and G-B. The minor third should be 1 bps faster than the Major, or about 9 1/2 and 8 1/2 bps, respectively. Check chromatic thirds F#-A#, G-B, and A flat to C -- they should increase by 1/2 bps each. Check chromatic sixths C- A, C#-A#, D-B, and E flat - C. They should also increase by 1/2 bps each. Then go back and check everything: 5ths, 4ths, Major 3rds, Major 6ths, minor 3rds, and make small corrections to smooth things out. None of these beat rates are absolute, and will vary slightly from piano to piano, but I feel it's a good temperament for learning, keeping in mind that it's easier on larger pianos, where you're not setting the temperament in the bass/treble break area. Sincerely, David Nereson, RPT, Denver ---------------------- multipart/alternative attachment An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: https://www.moypiano.com/ptg/pianotech.php/attachments/ae/55/cc/5f/attachment.htm ---------------------- multipart/alternative attachment--
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