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Hello Andre,
Very interesting post indeed, and are actual C3 C7 hammers using Wurzen or
not ?
Talking about the maintenance of the efficiency of the Yamaha hammers, a
common process here is to consider that the back of the hammer harden very
little, as it is considered as the springy part of the hammer. On the
contrary, the front top zone (from 10 to 11:30) harden much because it is
more solicited while playing, and it is responsible for most of the attack
noise.
Then taking back to original the volume and brilliance of an hardened Yamaha
hammer would be needling almost only the front to unpack that hard zone,
and also thumping hard on the 9:00 Zone , always front, to open the tone.
The maintenance of this imbalance allow for a longer string contact time
probably, and fight the natural tendency of these pianos to sound too
brilliant, and a tad metallic, it allows yet for the necessary phase, but
certainly not for a lot of power.
Indeed when needling the back top it is felt soon that the energy is still
there and that not a lot of needling is due there.
I have seen a Fazioli intoner working with the same idea , one side for
energy one side for power, equilibrium of the moments between the 2 sides to
obtain the "phasing". Battery needling on the back only to obtain a more
fast rebound .
Is not the imbalance induced by this method limiting the tonal range, you
said that you believe that the 2 sides of the hammer may absorb the shock,
but the front still act differently than the back is not it ? .
Is it what you mean when you say that you believe in symmetry ? or did you
mean only the shape of the head.?
The method I described there is giving a definite change in tone when
attaining certain level of velocity, on the other hand, I feel that the
possibilities offered are still a little binary, opposed to a full blooming
hammer with springiness on the 2 sides (in a simplified view of the
process).
Best,and thanks for sharing.
Isaac
Isaac OLEG
Entretien et réparation de pianos.
PianoTech
17 rue de Choisy
94400 VITRY sur SEINE
FRANCE
tel : 033 01 47 18 06 98
fax : 033 01 47 18 06 90
cell: 06 60 42 58 77
-----Message d'origine-----
De : pianotech-bounces@ptg.org [mailto:pianotech-bounces@ptg.org]De la
part de antares@euronet.nl
Envoyé : lundi 2 juin 2003 22:05
À : Pianotech
Objet : Re: hammers
On maandag, jun 2, 2003, at 11:03 Europe/Amsterdam, Dave Nereson wrote:
What?? The Steinways I've seen have always had an egg-shaped
hammer. Aren't we sposeta file trying to remove only one layer of felt, or
enough to remove the string grooves, without changing the shape of the whole
hammer (unless it's a grossly misshapen mess due to someone else's botch
job)?
Alright Dave, my explanation..........
Let me first state the following : I have only limited experience with
Steinways built in New York, so the Steinways I am talking about are Hamburg
Steinways and they ARE different.
The Steinways built in Hamburg have Renner hammers with Wurzen felt.
Those hammers are very round from the beginning and after first voicing
they are filed into a diamond shape, and much more 'diamondy' then you (or
I) would have imagined (it is actually frightening at first to see how small
a STW becomes after first filing.
This filing process is pretty extreme, but it does give the STW's a
certain 'edge' and brilliance you won't get if you leave them
un-diamond-filed.
And why would a Bechstein change for the worse with a diamond-shaped
hammer?
Because certain instruments ask for a hammer shape that causes more or
less overtones.
The Bechstein grand piano does not ask for a hammer which causes extra
brilliancy as the instrument itself already has a certain type of high
overtone sound. Give it more or too much, and you will make it an ugly
yelling monster with a pierced and shrill voice.
At Yamaha's Little Red Schoolhouse, they explained that Yamaha
purposely shapes their hammers with more of a diamond- than an egg-shape.
Sure, but look at the older type Yamaha's please and the hammers you order
for those instruments. You will notice that they are round and pear shaped
from the beginning.
The hammers for Yamaha's started to change into a more diamondy shape with
the introduction of the CFIII-S and at the same the introduction of the
Wurzen felt, mind you.
The Wurzen felt is a much different kind of felt than the felt Yamaha uses
on the regular - not hand made - models. It causes a different tone and asks
for a different treatment too. I can tell you this because I had (private)
lessons in Wurzen felt voicing in the Yamaha CFIII-S department (within the
factory), the Steinway factory in Hamburg and the Bechstein factory in
Berlin.
(At one time I met the technical director of Yamaha in Hamburg - Herr
Professor Dokter Lüdemann (ja ja) - and I proudlu told him about 'my
discovery' of the 'new' Wurzen felt, to which he sneered by telling me that
already some time ago he had made the same discovery and that already they
had proto-type CFIII-S actions with Wurzen hammers! Later that year, while
being in Hamburg, he summoned me to a secret place where he showed me one of
those 'Wurzen hammer' actions.
At Yamaha they are now changing there hammers because they have also
changed their models. Those things go hand in hand.
Are we saying that if the felt is on the soft side (Steinway,
especially early ones, and even late ones, compared to Asian hammers), it
will compress too much on a hard blow, flattening out and cancelling
partials, giving a dull tone, so we should file them to more of a diamond
shape? How do you do that without cutting across layers of felt in the
hammer?
There is difference in felt making between felt makers. One of the hammer
makers pre-sands its hammers and makes its felt is much and much more dense.
This causes a brilliant tone from the beginning but after a year or two the
instruments quickly lose their erstwhile beauty because the fibers in the
hammers, which were much more massed up together in the first place (and
thereby lost a lot of their natural resilience) become kind of hard thudding
dead clonkers, to be replaced as soon as possible. Those clonkers are dead
lumps if felt, there is no more 'life' in them.
I have experience with those clonkers for instance on Fazioli's and
Seilers.
Especially one Fazioli concert grand (and initially a nice Seiler too) I
remember very well. It was a gift from, I think, a bank to a brand new
Theater somewhere here in Holland. The Fazioli became - extremely - ugly
within 3 years and was given away!, to be replaced by a brand new Steinway D
(although I wish that I could have heard/played one of Ron Overs' grands as
he is, according to me, one of the leading piano makers in the world).
The Wurzen felt is not sanded from the beginning and the highly resilient
felt layers stay intact, causing the same very lively tone that the early
Steinways had in earlier days.
And if the felt is dense (Asian and others) and already
diamond-shaped (Yamaha and other Asian pianos), then it should have a richer
tone because it does not flatten out and cancel partials? But you said
YAM's change for the worse with a diamond shape. What do you mean,
"change"? They already have the diamond shape....???
YAM's change for the worse if you re-shape their hammers as if they are
modern (Hamburg) STW's. Why? because it alters the tone in the wrong way.
The tone becomes overstrained and hyper, with the emphasis on the higher
partials which the Yamaha does not need as they are already pretty
brilliant. If we take the development of Yamaha's into consideration we may
notice that the early Yamaha's were shrill and tinkly instruments. They
clearly were accepted by the Japanese consumers (at the time) but Yamaha had
to adapt to a more 'Western taste' of listening, which, over the years,
resulted in a neutral kind of Steinway clone, but without the 'boom' and
richness of said STW. (they are built completely different in the end and
have gone their own way)
In my perception of, and experience with, piano sounds, the shape of a
hammer has to adapt to the characteristics of a soundboard. The soundboard
(and the strings), asks for a certain 'commotion', by in fact a very
specific kind of hammer strike, that will cause it to sound in such a way
that we as listeners will like and thus approve of. A Bechstein with a sharp
protruding diamond shape hammers will definitely sound different than with a
more rounded off, egg shaped, hammer. A STW with a Bechstein hammer will
sound a little dull, without the specific STW brilliance and color gradation
we expect from it. A Bösendorfer with a STW hammer will 'speak too loud' and
thereby lose its romantic harmonics.
A Fazioli would definitely be a more interesting instrument, musically
speaking, with Wurzen hammers. One of the much heard complaints about
Fazioli's is that they sound so very loud and too uniform, without any
change of 'color', which makes especially Bechsteins and Bösendorfers so
attractive and magically divers.
Instead, the Fazioli maker wishes for his instruments to SOUND and SOUND,
as it were to prove that a Fazioli has unlimited power, just like, or even
more, than a Steinway.
A Yamaha CFIII-S basically does not give that same avalanche of loudness
although they may 'thunder' (the legendary S. Richter for instance on a
unique instrument built for him only. They have become more subtle because
they have, just like the others, a long history of piano making behind them
and an adapted taste. That's exactly why a YAM CFIII-S 'can be' magnificent,
masterly, and truly satisfying because the instrument is balanced and
rightly developed. They brought together the right materials and they have
learned through experience how to treat those materials.
I am more than convinced that Fazioli eventually will find its true
course. I am definitely not saying that Fazioli is a mediocre instrument, on
the contrary! They have, I think, a great deal of possibilities and
technically speaking they are superb. It is just a matter of more time.
Some Asian piano makers (I am not talking about Yamaha and Kawai) also
have not found their true course. The Koreans are rapidly developing ways to
flood the World with even more low cost pianos. I was there in the Samick
factories in Incheon and Djakarta and I was amazed by the speed and the
quantities of instruments leaving the factory(great guitars too). They
basically have good material (Wurzen hammers from Renner, soundboards from
Italy, Keyboards from Germany), but they still have to find a stable course.
Maybe Bechstein (50% take over) will be of great influence? The Chinese make
all the stuff in the World. They make literally everything and they make it
in a very inexpensive way. I have seen, and worked on, several Chinese
'Perzina' uprights.
They amazed me by their already reasonable quality but they still have a
long time to go, unless they can buy the right people for a lot of dollares
to make very fast competitive changes.
Anyway....my little story turned out a little longer than expected.
Hopefully it made any sense at all?
Antares,
The Netherlands
see my website at : www.concertpianoservice.nl
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