I appreciate what you are trying to say here David, but I think such an inclusive disclaimer would have to be very artfully written if we did not want to have the effect of scaring our potential customers off before they say yes. ("The estimate is for 10K, but it could be another 10 or 15....") Another way to approach it is to write estimates that are already quite inclusive. For example, I always replace pinblocks when restringing, with very rare exception (such as when the piano itself is still quite youthful). And examine the soundboard thoroughly when doing the estimate for bearing and crown, so that you are more likely to make that recommendation in the original estimate.
The situation I described has happened to me once in 37 years of rebuilding. Much of that time has been as a one person rebuilding shop, so I have not had as many pianos passing through my shop as a larger shop would, so other's mileage may vary. I have only recently started installing new soundboards, which has deepened my knowledge base dramatically. Fair to say I know a heck of a lot more than I did 25 years ago. Rebuilders like Ron and Dale and Del, who have a few hundred boards under their belt, could speak to how to look for the warning signs better than I can. Accurate assessment, coupled with their experience with how the boards behave after teardown, gives them a knowledge and experience base that allows them to better predict the need for a new board.
Still, it would be my guess that the surprises can happen to the best of us. If that is the case, then there is probably a limit to the accuracy of our predictability - nobody is going to be right 100% of the time, even the best among us. If it is not humanly possible for even our very best to hit the nail on the head all the time, then that would seem to limit the liability we rebuilders should reasonably assume when the occasional board behaves in a manner we could not predict.
This is a tough business that is very hard to make money at. So we should not rush to give away a whole lot of our time for free. Lord knows, there are enough things in rebuilding that seem to do that already. It's hard enough to get paid for every hour you work if you are going to do good work as it is.
Merry Christmas to all.
Will Truitt
-----Original Message-----
From: pianotech-bounces at ptg.org [mailto:pianotech-bounces at ptg.org] On Behalf Of David Ilvedson
Sent: Thursday, December 24, 2009 11:13 PM
To: pianotech at ptg.org
Subject: Re: [pianotech] Reversing Crown
We should be able to explain to customer the breakdown of the piano and what we may find once the plate is pulled. A disclaimer that lays out the possibility of a new soundboard, pinblock my have cracks we cannot see, etc. Give them the worse case, so they are prepared...
David Ilvedson, RPT
Pacifica, CA 94044
----- Original message ----------------------------------------
From: erwinspiano at aol.com
To: pianotech at ptg.org
Received: 12/24/2009 7:21:57 PM
Subject: Re: [pianotech] Reversing Crown
> Hi Will
> Well done. Well said. Trust is the real currency and professional capital of or of our
>occupation. It's humbling, and gratifying.
> Dale
>Ultimately, it’s all based on trust and their faith in you. That’s the real
>grease of the relationship, not the paper the estimate is written on. Good people
>skills, along with meticulous truthfulness, are what keep you out of court.
>
>Will Truitt
>
>
>
>
>From: pianotech-bounces at ptg.org [mailto:pianotech-bounces at ptg.org] On Behalf
>Of erwinspiano at aol.com
>Sent: Thursday, December 24, 2009 5:36 PM
>To: pianotech at ptg.org
>Subject: Re: [pianotech] Reversing Crown
>
> Having been on church elder boards that balance budgets,activities and
>maintenace issues my experience is that there many really good hearted people
>involved who either run their own businesses or have skills of disernment in many
>areas. Honesty is the best policy & honest miscalculations are recieved with
>understanding...Honesty is always the best policy and respect comes right behind it.
>Chin up mate...plan B
> Dale
>Ok, help me understand this (mainly the words in bold). I'm not trying to be ugly in
>any sense of the word, just trying to understand.
>
>At the point where you find the zero or negative crown surprise, I'm assuming
>you've already destrung at a minimum. Are you going to "walk away from the job"
>with the piano unstrung and just return it to them that way? Or are you going to
>give it a quick restring in an attempt to put it back in it's original condition to return
>it? Or are you going to perform the work you originally contracted for... which
>doesn't sound like "walking away", but maybe could be interpreted that way?
>
>Some have mentioned finding negative crown after having removed a soundboard
>so if you haven't contracted for removing (replacing, or possibly repairing?) the
>soundboard in the first place, you wouldn't have it out to find that negative crown.
>
>It is good that the church in your example went for the new board. In for a penny,
>in for a pound. But had they not, at what point were you in the tear down process
>and what would you have done at that point? Or what would you have wanted to
>do in that point?
>
>Again, not trying to pick on you, but I'm having a hard time mentally getting to an
>answer that would be good for both parties and stand up in front of a judge.
>
>Hoping you can help me understand. Sincerely.
>
>Thanks,
>
>Brian
>
>
>From: surfdog at metrocast.net
>To: pianotech at ptg.org
>Date: Thu, 24 Dec 2009 06:09:26 -0500
>Subject: Re: [pianotech] Reversing Crown
>I agree with David. Twenty five years ago I rebuilt a 6’ 4†Vose grand for a
>church. It had some positive downbearing before I tore it down. After the plate
>was out, the crown had headed south for a permanent vacation, and obviously so.
>I had heard from others that sometimes the strings are literally holding the crown
>and it lets go when they are removed. That was my first and only.
>
>I approached the church about replacing the board after having contacted my
>bellyman at the time and costing everything out. I had prepared a detailed
>explanation why it needed to be done, and why it would be spending bad money to
>not do it, and be spending good money to do it – even though it was a
>considerable cost increase to them. I explained it matter of factly and without
>apology (why would I apologize for a condition that I did not cause and could not
>have foreseen?) They went for the new board, and were happy with the rebuild
>when done.
>
>It is simply too heavy a load to bear for you to assume the cost of replacing the
>soundboard. You are not that far into the job yet, and I would simply walk away
>from the job if they are not inclined to proceed.
>
>I don’t think it is that common for us to have this kind of surprise, but it does
>happen.
>
>As others have said already, taking a number of careful down bearing readings and
>crown readings when doing the estimate make such an ugly surprise a less likely
>occurrence.
>
>It is also important to have a written disclaimer in your estimate about unforeseen
>conditions before teardown. Resist the impulse to split the difference with them,
>they will believe it is your fault if you do.
>
>It is also possible that the reason why the board has oilcanned is related to bad work
>done originally at the factory lo those many years ago. They weren’t always
>perfect in the factory in 1929 either, although we all want to believe those were the
>Golden Years. But sometimes they drank their lunch on Friday back then too.
>
>Will Truitt
>
>
>
>Hotmail: Trusted email with powerful SPAM protection. Sign up now. =
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