My membership DOES NOT come into play in this discussion - SO - just drop it.
FYI, I was a member until I could not afford the dues and the overall subject
atter did not include much about the
ntique player systems.
PLUS, as in what a lot of other persons are saying, who gives a rats arse about
he home office - to us (non-members
ncluded), it's all about the tech list (functionality, ease of use, syncing
ith other devices, etc)
Duaine
First, regarding membership. Although the PTG does not concentrate on antique player systems, there are discussions about them once in a while, just as you only occasionally tune, and there are discussions about that, too. Dues are what they are. Perhaps if you took full advantage of what the dues will get you, membership might actually be worth it. The best example of this was the recent convention. There were no classes specifically on player systems, but there were many classes related to upright and grand repairs and regulations. After all, what good does it to repair the player system if the piano itself doesn't work. And of course, there were lots of classes on tuning, including using your favorite ETD. I even invited you to one of my tutoring sessions, at no cost, but didn't take advantage.
As far as the home office is concerned, you had better care, because without them, we wouldn't be here. Well, we might be here, but can you imagine having one of us run this organization out of our office, instead of having dedicated professionals to it for us. Which, I learned in a class on the history of PTG at the convention, it used be. Members processing paperwork, editing Journals, and basically keeping the organization running.
The fact that you are even able to participate in this list, Duaine, is entirely due to volunteers in the PTG, who pay dues, and Home Office Staff, dedicating their time to keep this list, and the others, available for piano tuners like your self. We appreciate and welcome your technical discussions, but please keep your misguided personal opinions about the lists, and the PTG, to yourself.
Wim
-----Original Message-----
From: Duaine Hechler <dahechler at att.net>
To: pianotech <pianotech at ptg.org>
Sent: Wed, Jul 20, 2011 6:02 am
Subject: Re: [pianotech] Horse and buggy users.
Again, William,
My membership DOES NOT come into play in this discussion - SO - just drop it.
FYI, I was a member until I could not afford the dues and the overall subject
atter did not include much about the
ntique player systems.
PLUS, as in what a lot of other persons are saying, who gives a rats arse about
he home office - to us (non-members
ncluded), it's all about the tech list (functionality, ease of use, syncing
ith other devices, etc)
Duaine
On 07/20/2011 10:45 AM, William Monroe wrote:
Again, Duaine,
It goes beyond the list serv and it's function. It encompasses all of the PTG
rganizational functions as well.
As a non-member I can see how that is meaningless to you, but to some of us it
oes matter.
William R. Monroe
On Wed, Jul 20, 2011 at 10:30 AM, Duaine Hechler <dahechler at att.net
mailto:dahechler at att.net>> wrote:
Here we go again .........
I thought this subject was supposed to be banned - I know I got my last
mail "slapped" for bringing this up again.
So now that it is here again, I'll chime in again.
Comparison of the new list, is like the Edsel.
It was ahead of it's time ..... not well accepted ..... and became a rare
ntique very quickly.
I see the new list going in the same direction.
As you can see, this was submitted under the old list - only.
Regards, Duaine
P.S. What happened to the old adage - "if it ain't broke, don't fix it"
!?!?!?!?
On 07/20/2011 09:11 AM, William Monroe wrote:
Will,
I can't say that I condone Israel's approach to "encouraging" everyone
o use the new system. I can say,
however, that your suggestion, you quoted,
"If a thing can be done adequately by means of one, it is superfluous
o do it by means of several; for we
observe that nature does not employ two instruments [if] one suffice”.
hat’s a pretty good measure for any
software interface design. By that measure, to claim that the new HL
orum software represents a paradigm
shift is laughable."
It is essential that everyone who reads this forum (and who will
ventually be using the new system)
understands that the paradigm shift (it really is) reaches far beyond
mail lists. The new software works
wonderfully for so much of what the home office needs it to do to
rack and maintain membership,
communications, and the integrating so many needs for the organization
of which the email list is only one.
Please understand, I value the list as much as anyone, and I don't
ean to imply that the new system is as
simple as the old. Neither do I intend to denigrate any of it's
sers. However, there are other
considerations for PTG besides the list. The new software does a
emarkable job filling the needs of the PTG
and incorporating the lists as well. I'll say it again because it is
xtremely important that we on the list
fully understand: the needs of PTG are much more than just the list.
To be sure, the list is important and it was considered. And, it does
ontinue to function on the new
software. It is absolutely different. It is in some ways more
roublesome. It is in some ways better. List
folks (and I include myself in that number) need to move past the
nitial frustrations, log on, take the time
to get set up as your needs see fit, and learn to use it. If we
imply refuse to use it, it will never work
for us. I'm discovering that as I use it more, it becomes vastly
impler.
Again, the new software is a big step forward for the PTG on the
rganizational level. It may complicate the
list function for a bit until we all take the time to learn to use it
ffectively, but it will happen.
William R. Monroe
On Wed, Jul 20, 2011 at 8:11 AM, Encore Pianos <encorepianos at metrocast.net
mailto:encorepianos at metrocast.net>
<mailto:encorepianos at metrocast.net <mailto:encorepianos at metrocast.net>>>
rote:
Dear Isreal:
Hmmmm…. “:fellow luddites”, “horse and buggy drivers
omplaining how difficult it is to start a car”,
“horseshit”, “can the attitude”, “small but loud group who refuse
o develop basic web skills” “files YOU
PEOPLE
were shoving onto my computer (caps added by me, wow, a conspiracy,
hat fun!) “massaging each other’s egos”
And now for the real kicker, “the relatively minor glitches that
ny paradigm shift entails”. PARADIGM
SHIFT?????!!!!!!!!, Isn’t that a bit like a 2 ½ foot tall guy
unking the ball into a basket 2 feet off the
ground and claiming “player of the year?”
Jon Page doesn’t need me to defend him and I won’t speak for him.
will say that I have met Jon and spent a
little time with him, and have followed his posts on the forum over
he past years. Somehow, luddite never
enters my mind when I think of Jon. And please note that the group
f people you describe as luddites and
horse
and buggy drivers includes the following people, if we are
ncluding those who have expressed their lack of
enthusiasm for the new forum: Del Fandrich, Ron Nossaman, Dale
rwin, David Andersen, and David Love;
amongst
many ohers.
I admire both Del and Ron for their approach to problem solving and
esign, because they so well apply these
variations on “Occam’s Razor”, “Simplicity is the ultimate
ophistication” and “Entities must not be
multiplied
beyond necessity”. It is always a sign of an elegant and
enetrating mind to seek the simplest and most
direct
solution.that fulfills all necessary criteria.
I think this saying from Saint Thomas Aquinas is most topical when
hinking of software, particularly the HL
PIanotech web software: "If a thing can be done adequately by means
f one, it is superfluous to do it by
means of
several; for we observe that nature does not employ two instruments
if] one suffice”. That’s a pretty good
measure for any software interface design. By that measure, to
laim that the new HL forum software
represents a
paradigm shift is laughable.
Will Truitt
--
Duaine Hechler
Piano, Player Piano, Pump Organ
Tuning, Servicing& Rebuilding
Reed Organ Society Member
Florissant, MO 63034
(314) 838-5587 <tel:%28314%29%20838-5587>
dahechler at att.net <mailto:dahechler at att.net>
www.hechlerpianoandorgan.com <http://www.hechlerpianoandorgan.com>
--
Home& Business user of Linux - 11 years
-
uaine Hechler
iano, Player Piano, Pump Organ
uning, Servicing& Rebuilding
eed Organ Society Member
lorissant, MO 63034
314) 838-5587
ahechler at att.net
ww.hechlerpianoandorgan.com
-
ome& Business user of Linux - 11 years
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